Factory visit--questions/observations

mobilrvn

Member
Have been in the Goshen/Elkhart area checking out a replacement 5W for our Montana. Happened into the Heartland Ralley at the Fairgrounds in Goshen as a bonus since BH is at the top of our list, mostly because of weight considerations and our TV.

Eric gave us a great tour of the Heartland facilities and we also visited a couple more mfgrs. and many RV lots. Thank you, Eric. Our visits seemed to make us more confused than able to zero in on one rig.

Biggest difficulty for us is that most mfgrs. including BH use Lippert frames and this has been the biggest source of a good part of our problems. We did get the frame fixed at the factory, but we still have questions in our minds whether it will hold up or not. Know that there have been some of the same problems still continuing with Lippert frames.

We cannot understand why all the mfgrs. are such copycats, especially when they copy things which are bad. The latest trend is the side aisle bathroom which we like except when it takes away closet space up front with the W/D placement. Here BH has compounded the mistake with a storage space which takes up the other side of the front closest (would be OK if it had a convertible hanging space to use either as a shirt closet or cupboard). Anyone using their 5W through two seasons or more (say a trip to Alaska) needs the full closet space across the front of the 5W.

We feel that there is a movement by the mfgrs. of not wanting to sell RVs to fulltimers (BH warranty exclusion, e.g.). Think the industry is going the wrong say with the oncoming babyboomers who are going to keep the industry afloat, but only if they are treated right. A lot of this potential market want to fulltime. Don't understand why mfgrs. can't make a 5W which will last for 365 days of use and to guarantee it!

Saw some small, but important issues to us with the BH. First thing that struck us was the various heights of the microwave/convection ovens. We have one now as our only oven, so maybe it was more apparent to us. In some of the BHs, the heights were very dangerous for an average height woman to get something boiling hot out of the oven since she had to reach way overhead. DW is fairly tall, but she had trouble with many of them. Isn't there some type of standard?

Many of the cupboards had open tops with totally unuseable space above them good only for collecting dust and bugs. Either run the top of the cupboars to the ceiling or cut them down enough where you can use the space for storage or decoration. Our choice is to go for the ceiling.

We think that the wallboard color is absolutely terrible. Saw that Cardinal was using the same babypoop color in their line--more copycatting? Neutral colored walls is the way to go. Most RV furniture is terrible, too. Why not have an option for Lazyboy recliners? Most of us have replaced the original furniture with them anyway. We'd be happier and BH would make some money on it.

One question we had for Eric which he didn't have a ready answer was, " can you get white framed window instead of black(since Landmark has them)?" He thought it was a question of $$--could be, but know that Everest has them and Montana doesn't, yet both cost about the same. Saw many cheaper towables with white windows. Think they look better and they don't show the dust as bad.

Went to CampingWorld in Elkhart and they had the thin wall Dometic refrigerators (9.5 cuft) vs. the standard RV industry one (7.7 cuft) for $100 less! Seems like the thin wall refer should be the RV standard. We'd get more storage and the mfgrs. would make more $$.

Does Heartland have designers or use a design team? We always wonder what a 5W would look like if the Extreme Home Makeover people were put to the task of building a 5W. We understand that most changes are small and made over time, but maybe it is the time for a shift in such thinking (can anyone figure out a better sewage system?) Heartland should be the leader, not the follower. Heartland is still on our list.
 
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gawelsh

Well-known member
HEY we saw your rig at the Rally - I was going to tease you about being surrounded by the competition, but you weren't out whenever we walked by. I understand some of your points....we're not full-timers, but do plan on spending all our vacations in our Landmark, so we want all the amenities, as well. Some of the things you mention are a matter of taste, I guess. We also are removing the big ultra leather chairs and putting in smaller La z Boys. We also added a lift-top, trunk style coffee table.

Overall, though, we're so pleased with our rig, especially with the way Heartland stands by their customers - what a remarkable company. We decided to buy from them primarily for that reason - I said THIS IS A COMPANY I WANT TO DO BUSINESS WITH....there were other comparable 5th wheels on our short list, but none with the support of a Forum and a
factory like we have here.

Enjoy your search and hope to see you at another Heartland Rally - this time in your BH !:)
 

Pulltab

Well-known member
Some very good observations, unfortunately getting changes made seem to be a challange. Excellent ideas and points though. :)
 

fireflipper

EX-Travel Bug
Fireflipper

HI Pulltab
Just wanted to say hello and glad I met you at the park in Elkhart. We are home now and back to work, what a bummer.
 

bfast54

Will camp for fun
Greetings Pull-Tab, I must see your new trailer, gotta get down there .:D


As to the Question, of designers, well, I wonder who makes a lot of the choices in colors, fabrics, etc..., for a lot of the manufactures , some are really awful !!!!!!!:eek:
 

Pulltab

Well-known member
Hey Fireflipper. it was great meeting you also. Sorry I didn't see this post earlier.

Hi to you to Mark, glad to see you come to the board. Come on down any time. Gotta say thanks and glad you had set up that factory tour for everyone at the rally as it led to us buying a Bighorn which we are really happy with! :) Then just a couple of weeks later some good friends of ours like it so much they bought one! :):) Heartland should send you a bonus check. HEY JIM WANNA CHECK INTO THAT FOR HIM! :)
 
I am thinking of getting a 3400rl and was wondering if the factory was considering going to disk brakes or even as an upgrade. Thanks Sonny
 

Goldenwingers

goldenwingers
Sonny, we had disk brakes added to our Landmark. I believe the factory had them installed by Recreational Specialist who has a shop nearby . I have found that the brakes are awesome when they apply but there is a delay of about three seconds after hitting the brakes before the disk brakes apply. This can be an eternity in a panic stop. I believe the option was around $2500.

Don
 

Oldlthrnecksgirl

Hisyoungercuterwife
mobilrvn said:
Have been in the Goshen/Elkhart area checking out a replacement 5W for our Montana. Happened into the Heartland Ralley at the Fairgrounds in Goshen as a bonus since BH is at the top of our list, mostly because of weight considerations and our TV.

Eric gave us a great tour of the Heartland facilities and we also visited a couple more mfgrs. and many RV lots. Thank you, Eric. Our visits seemed to make us more confused than able to zero in on one rig.

Biggest difficulty for us is that most mfgrs. including BH use Lippert frames and this has been the biggest source of a good part of our problems. We did get the frame fixed at the factory, but we still have questions in our minds whether it will hold up or not. Know that there have been some of the same problems still continuing with Lippert frames.

We cannot understand why all the mfgrs. are such copycats, especially when they copy things which are bad. The latest trend is the side aisle bathroom which we like except when it takes away closet space up front with the W/D placement. Here BH has compounded the mistake with a storage space which takes up the other side of the front closest (would be OK if it had a convertible hanging space to use either as a shirt closet or cupboard). Anyone using their 5W through two seasons or more (say a trip to Alaska) needs the full closet space across the front of the 5W.



We feel that there is a movement by the mfgrs. of not wanting to sell RVs to fulltimers (BH warranty exclusion, e.g.). Think the industry is going the wrong say with the oncoming babyboomers who are going to keep the industry afloat, but only if they are treated right. A lot of this potential market want to fulltime. Don't understand why mfgrs. can't make a 5W which will last for 365 days of use and to guarantee it!

Saw some small, but important issues to us with the BH. First thing that struck us was the various heights of the microwave/convection ovens. We have one now as our only oven, so maybe it was more apparent to us. In some of the BHs, the heights were very dangerous for an average height woman to get something boiling hot out of the oven since she had to reach way overhead. DW is fairly tall, but she had trouble with many of them. Isn't there some type of standard?

Many of the cupboards had open tops with totally unuseable space above them good only for collecting dust and bugs. Either run the top of the cupboars to the ceiling or cut them down enough where you can use the space for storage or decoration. Our choice is to go for the ceiling.

We think that the wallboard color is absolutely terrible. Saw that Cardinal was using the same babypoop color in their line--more copycatting? Neutral colored walls is the way to go. Most RV furniture is terrible, too. Why not have an option for Lazyboy recliners? Most of us have replaced the original furniture with them anyway. We'd be happier and BH would make some money on it.

One question we had for Eric which he didn't have a ready answer was, " can you get white framed window instead of black(since Landmark has them)?" He thought it was a question of $$--could be, but know that Everest has them and Montana doesn't, yet both cost about the same. Saw many cheaper towables with white windows. Think they look better and they don't show the dust as bad.

Went to CampingWorld in Elkhart and they had the thin wall Dometic refrigerators (9.5 cuft) vs. the standard RV industry one (7.7 cuft) for $100 less! Seems like the thin wall refer should be the RV standard. We'd get more storage and the mfgrs. would make more $$.

Does Heartland have designers or use a design team? We always wonder what a 5W would look like if the Extreme Home Makeover people were put to the task of building a 5W. We understand that most changes are small and made over time, but maybe it is the time for a shift in such thinking (can anyone figure out a better sewage system?) Heartland should be the leader, not the follower. Heartland is still on our list.

I guess in answer to this, it is all a matter of taste? I am not responding to the comments about the frame because I just don't know anything about it.

1. We are fulltiming it in our BH. Right now we are living in a somewhat glorified parking lot due to the influx of workers in the area and it doesn't have laundry facilities so we have a laundry service that picks up and drops off. I have never seen a rig yet where I would prefer a washer/dryer over the closet space.

2. I am 5'7" and can't reach everything in any rig at the top of the cupboards so we bought one of those little step stools. When folded, it takes up about 10"x 10" x 2". I love the space above the cupboards because it perfectly holds my large griddle and a double hot plate. I would have no place to put them if I didn't have that one area.

3. The microwave/convection oven is a little high but once again, that little step stool removes any safety hazard.

4. One of the first things that struck me when we walked into what became our rig was the wall colour. We had a Coachmen with white/bluish tinge walls and I thought it was so cold and I loved the warmth of the BH. I love the sueded texture as well. I love the fact that they used such a rich, deep navy in the sofa. I am not fond of the medium blue in the bedroom on the curtains and bedspread/pillows but that is an easy change at a later date.

5. One of the things we noticed when we spent some time looking, discussing the BH, was how comfortable the furniture was. Both my husband and I have napped in the recliners. The couch is great for me, I love tucking my legs under me and no matter what position I get into, its comfy.

6. I prefer the black trim around the windows. After working on a glazing (window) crew for a few years I noticed the cheaper window units always had the white, the more luxiourious units were usually black unless they had a specific custom colour ordered. I find the black "disappears" where as the white screams, HI! Im a window trim.

7. Our last rig had a side by side refrigerator and I was more than a little worried about losing some of the space. I have found the design of this fridge to be much better and I really haven't lost any space. It more than handles the needs for us two full timers. My husband asked if I would like to upgrade the fridge but I didn't want to lose the pull out pantry.

I did have some ideas that I had for the "perfect" rig for us which I started a thread on but overall, I am more than happy.

"One man's meat is another man's poison"
 

Forrest Fetherolf

Senior Member
Quote.........
Sonny, we had disk brakes added to our Landmark. I believe the factory had them installed by Recreational Specialist who has a shop nearby . I have found that the brakes are awesome when they apply but there is a delay of about three seconds after hitting the brakes before the disk brakes apply. This can be an eternity in a panic stop. I believe the option was around $2500.

Don

I read your post, something isn't right if you trailer disc brakes delay about three seconds, that is way to long for the brakes to activate. I have found that when I need the trailer brakes, I need them now. What brake controller are you using, could be in need of adjustment! I use the BrakeSmart controller, it is the best because it works with the truck's hydaulic brake system, not time or inertia.

Forrest
 

jbeletti

Well-known member
Sonny,

The factory will not do disk brakes but many dealers will have a vendor in their area that can do the work.

In Don's case, I believe his dealer had RS add them before the unit left Elkhart.

Jim
 
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