bad transfer switch

tammyinwv

Member
we are camping at myrtle beach and the transfer switch fried on shore power, started the gen but now micowave vac and one tv doesnt work, even run there own power cord didn"t help. Will hearthland cover every thing the camper is 10 months old. No other campers had and trouble.
 

brianharrison

Well-known member
Have a knowledgeable person check the shore power pedestal for your trailer - it may have a poor power situation or grounding issue. A Mobile RV tech may be able to come out and trouble shoot to make sure it is only the transfer switch, and not any other components in your unit. Be careful - AC power can be dangerous.
 

scottyb

Well-known member
It sounds a lot like what happened to mine when it was 2 days old. You could smell it when I removed the basement wall. It was replaced and 6 months later, another one quit working. HL sent me a new TS but I only had intermittent power from on the genny. I traced it back to the J-box where the wires from the genny connect to the coach wiring. All the wires were poorly landed in the j-box. The neutral wire only had a few strands making the connection and the wire nut was scorched. I cut off the ends and made a proper connections on all the wires. No more issues to date.
 

danemayer

Well-known member
we are camping at myrtle beach and the transfer switch fried on shore power, started the gen but now micowave vac and one tv doesnt work, even run there own power cord didn"t help. Will hearthland cover every thing the camper is 10 months old. No other campers had and trouble.

Hi tammyinwv,

Sounds like your electrical system got hit with something from the outside. My first thought was that with genny running, only one side of the fried transfer switch was passing power. But if you tried operating the TV using an extension cord plugged into a working outlet, that argues that the TV got fried. Also the vacuum cleaner. All that strongly suggests you were plugged into a defective pedestal, or got an electrical surge of some kind.

Do you use an Electrical Management System/Surge Protector?
 

DougS

Doug S
Sounds like what happened to mine last year while traveling. I took the cover off the transfer switch box and some of the wires were fried. Mine were plastic covered wires touching one another and I guess by the motion of travel shorted them. I believe mine was a Progressive. I called their 800 number and they sent a new transfer switch to me, I had to send the old one back. They would not cover labor because I was out of warrantee, but did not charge for the switch or postage.
My main A/C was on the half of the RV that was out. I spiced out the burned out transfer switch, by installing a temporary electric box, to get through the 100+ degree temps. Within a week I had the new transfer switch which I had mailed to my next campground.
 

Hogladyrider

Well-known member
Same thing happened to us last Thanksgiving while at a State Park here in Florida, we could smell the electrical! We do not have a generator it was a result of faulty wiring from the factory. Since our rig is a 2009 it was not covered under any warranty. I am blessed that my other half could fix it himself. It fried our convection oven, central vac and the bedroom TV. We replaced with a basic microwave from Walmart and a Sharp vac with a shoulder strap and a new flat screen TV and we have had no problems since. We have owned our Big Horn since 2009 and this was the first real issue we have encountered so we consider ourselves blessed. We love our RV. Susan
 

tammyinwv

Member
we will be taking it to holmans to get it fix, our local dealer that services heartland said that would not service it because we didn"t buy it there, another dealer said they sold only one brand of heartland and said we would have to have approval. holman said about a ten day turn around, as long as we get it back before september we will be all right the gen with 8hrs on it is blowing oil so it will be fix also.
 

Wrenched

Member
Scottyb:
My transfer switch dropped out yesterday while the generator was running in our 2013 4100. I wasn't connected to anything at the time. I checked all the fuses, no problems anywhere. Genset checked OK.

I checked the junction box next to the genset and, lo and behold, like you mentioned, the strands for the small gauge wires were very poorly wrapped around the large wires. One of the wire nuts was burned up. I cleaned everything up and stripped new, longer strands and wrapped them well with new wire nuts.

Everything is working fine again. I was disappointed to see the shoddy wiring in the box.

I wonder if people should take a look at their junction boxes just to see if there's a failure waiting to happen. Could be expensive (even for Heartland if under warranty).
 

tammyinwv

Member
we are camping at myrtle beach and the transfer switch fried on shore power, started the gen but now micowave vac and one tv doesnt work, even run there own power cord didn"t help. Will hearthland cover every thing the camper is 10 months old. No other campers had and trouble.

We took the camper to Holman's for repairs. Now we are told the transfer switch was on recall ,however we were never notified. They also said the switch was bad and was going to replace it under warranty. However they tell us that the Progressive Dynamic switch can NOT cause an "open neutral" as we have been told by electrical engineers, which would have caused the damaged appliances. It was a clear sunny day at the beach when we returned and found the power off and appliances fried. No one else had any problems. We had campground check pedestal without telling them there was damages. No breaker was kicked and the box tested fine with their tools. We have had the camper less than a yr. We had to replace all 4 tires because one developed a softball size swelling on the side. Luckily no blow out. Now the appliances. What else? The sticker on the side of the camper when we purchased said GVWR was 18,000, but now after researching this failed transfer switch we find out that was false too. It is actually 16,gvwr. Meaning we are over max when we have the 2 bikes in the garage. After expense and time of installing tie downs in there. We are ready to just have it bought back. We had a Holiday rambler Presidential fifth wheel for about 10 yrs. Still looked like new when we sold it. Wish I still had it now.
 

scottyb

Well-known member
Scottyb:
My transfer switch dropped out yesterday while the generator was running in our 2013 4100. I wasn't connected to anything at the time. I checked all the fuses, no problems anywhere. Genset checked OK.

I checked the junction box next to the genset and, lo and behold, like you mentioned, the strands for the small gauge wires were very poorly wrapped around the large wires. One of the wire nuts was burned up. I cleaned everything up and stripped new, longer strands and wrapped them well with new wire nuts.

Everything is working fine again. I was disappointed to see the shoddy wiring in the box.

I wonder if people should take a look at their junction boxes just to see if there's a failure waiting to happen. Could be expensive (even for Heartland if under warranty).

Glad I could help. I suspect this issue was the root cause of both my transfer switches going bad.
 

brianharrison

Well-known member
We took the camper to Holman's for repairs. Now we are told the transfer switch was on recall ,however we were never notified. They also said the switch was bad and was going to replace it under warranty. However they tell us that the Progressive Dynamic switch can NOT cause an "open neutral" as we have been told by electrical engineers, which would have caused the damaged appliances. It was a clear sunny day at the beach when we returned and found the power off and appliances fried. No one else had any problems. We had campground check pedestal without telling them there was damages. No breaker was kicked and the box tested fine with their tools. We have had the camper less than a yr. We had to replace all 4 tires because one developed a softball size swelling on the side. Luckily no blow out. Now the appliances. What else? The sticker on the side of the camper when we purchased said GVWR was 18,000, but now after researching this failed transfer switch we find out that was false too. It is actually 16,gvwr. Meaning we are over max when we have the 2 bikes in the garage. After expense and time of installing tie downs in there. We are ready to just have it bought back. We had a Holiday rambler Presidential fifth wheel for about 10 yrs. Still looked like new when we sold it. Wish I still had it now.

Can you please post the info from your dealer that states the transfer switch is under recall - and they were going to replace it. I cannot find any information online for indication of Heartland transfer switches recalls (Progressive Dynamics). I know of the IOTA transfer switch recalls and I am unaware of HL using IOTA transfer switches.

Do you trust the campground to test for open neutral, or open ground - which usually causes surges, or high voltages - if you did not disclose your issue. A simple test of the pedestal may not indicate any problem. And yes it can only affect one pedestal and not the entire campground, hence you may be the unlucky one. 50amp services are the most notorious for poor installations in campgrounds, as older campgrounds try to retrofit undersized old 30amp systems to accommodate larger rigs. Finally, do you think the campground would test and admit any liability if they did find an issue. I still think it is an external power quality issue.

Good luck.
 

tammyinwv

Member
I dont have any info as yet from dealer, since this was just discussed over the phone. perhaps you can call Holman Motors in Ohio and ask them. as for the pedestal, we just at first told them our lights were flickering, I video recorded them checking the pedestal and what they were telling me. we have been screwed over by people several times in the past and trust no one. The breaker on the pedestal had not been tripped. Everything tested OK with their voltage meter. as for the open neutral issue, them checking the pedestal and things on their end , I doubt would show the problem as this occurs in the transfer switch itself.
And "no", the campground would not assume liability without being forced into it, thats why we didnt say anything up front about there being anything to be liable for. Just flickering lights. Then when everything checked OK, then we told them of our issues. The electrical engineer we spoke to had many yrs experience plus work in the Navy. he said the transfer switches themselves DO have a problem with open neutral. Now I dont know for sure about the specific Progressive dyanmic, but he di say the ones with 3 wire like we have. When we called the dealer from campground trying to figure out the problem, they referred us to a local repair shop, but do to the fact we would have to bring the camper in, we didnt, but my husband did discuss what was going on. The tech said with certainty that the issue was definitly the transfer switch. seems kind of odd, there is a recall of the switch and they say it was bad, and just coinicdently it goes out at the exact same time as the appliances.
tammy
 

danemayer

Well-known member
as for the open neutral issue, them checking the pedestal and things on their end , I doubt would show the problem as this occurs in the transfer switch itself.
Or an open/intermittent neutral problem could be at the pedestal. Fried appliances in the absence of lightning strikes do get reported from time to time. I would say that the majority go back to a pedestal problem.
 

tammyinwv

Member
we have camped at the campground for almost 12 yrs without problem. Pedestal checked OK, and things worked when plugged directly into shore power at pedestal.Just not thru trailer TS
 

tammyinwv

Member
Check out this thread concerning my series of blown appliances on two different trips:
//heartlandowners.org/showthread.php/41583-ATF-Cyclone-Repeated-Blown-Appliances

Also read my email from Progressive Dynamics concerning Open neutral. They are the makers of my transfer switch. Email is attached.
tammy
 

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Hippy

Well-known member
Need some help with electrical info. 2014 Cyclone 3110. 1st time out was shore power. This time (2nd time out) been running generator approx. 3 hours total off and for the past 2 days. This morning turned on the generator and all electrical outlets worked fine for about 15 minutes when everything shut down with exception the micro and fridg. Checked the GFI in the bathroom, won't respond to the test. Also checked the fuses to include turning off and on all the breaker switches. Can somebody give me an Idea where to start for possible problems.
 

danemayer

Well-known member
Checked the GFI in the bathroom, won't respond to the test.
Hi Hippy,

I'm not sure what you mean. Is the GFI outlet hot or not? If the GFI has tripped for some reason, and is staying tripped, many of your outlets will stop working.

How about other 110V appliances: TV, fireplace, air conditioners, electric side of the water heater?

If the microwave is working, you have at least partial power from the generator through the transfer switch to the circuit breakers.

Check the circuit breakers on the generator to see if one has tripped. That would take out 1/2 of your circuit breakers.
 

Hippy

Well-known member
Got it. It was the breaker switch in the generator. Never had a generator. Something new. Thanks.
 

wdk450

Well-known member
Gang:
I wanted to throw in a couple of observations about this thread.

First of all, the reported main cause of these problems in this thread is poor wiring connections. A little preventative maintenance on the wiring connections in the transfer switch and the generator junction box (if a generator is installed) on any unit that has not had this area inspected would be a good idea. All of the transfer switch connection screws should be tight, and the wires separate to avoid shorts.

Second of all, all of the transfer switches I know of use a large triple pole double throw relay to switch the two live phases and the neutrals between the two power sources and the output to the AC breaker box. This large relay has a set of contacts for each of the 3 wires for each source (6 contacts) with a magnetically actuated contact arm (mechanically returned to the one position by a spring) for each of the 3 output wires. The 3 contact arms have double contacts, one set on each side of the contact arm. These high current contacts are subject to arcing and pitting when switched with loads present: the arcing and pitting can create a poor connection, which when it happens on the neutral feeds can cause the same open neutral - high voltage feeds as an open neutral on an RV park electrical pedestal. THIS MEANS THAT ANY OF US WITH A TRANSFER SWITCH IN OUR POWER WIRING LAYOUT COULD EXPERIENCE THE OPEN NEUTRAL TYPE PROBLEM DUE TO TRANSFER SWITCH CONTACT PITTING. IF YOUR RIG HAS A GENERATOR OR "GENERATOR PREP" YOU HAVE A TRANSFER SWITCH.
The good news is that the contact pitting problem is mostly caused by the transfer relay switching while electrical loads are present. If you don't have or use a generator, the transfer relay is just going to sit in the spring actuated "Shore Power" position ALL the time, never switch, and should not pit or corrode. If you DO use your generator, you can minimize this contact pitting damage within the transfer relay by TURNING OFF THE MAIN AC BREAKERS BEFORE STARTING THE GENERATOR. This will allow the transfer switch to change the contacts connections with no power loads. THEN AFTER THE TRANSFER SWITCH SWITCHES ( I can hear an audible "clunk" inside my trailer when this happens), about 30 seconds after starting your generator, you can turn the AC mains breakers back on. If you use the generator regularly, you may want to service the transfer switch about once a year; removing all trailer power sources, opening the transfer relay box, and using a thin file and contact cleaner/improver spray on all 6 sets of contacts.

Just to clarify my rig's wiring, I had "generator prep" but no installed generator. I installed a battery-powered 1500 watt pure sine wave inverter system and ran the AC power output from the inverter into the "generator" inputs (with the 2 hot terminals jumpered) of the transfer switch. I have a remote inverter on-off switch in the trailer control panel. So my inverter functions as my "generator" and I carry a portable generator in the truck to hook to the shore power cord, if needed.
 
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