EDGE w/Juice Module for LMM

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NewCyclone

Active Member
Anybody interested in used EDGE w/Juice module? It is made for the LMM engine and still new. Only used it for one week. My wife gave me enough heart burn about us violating the truck warranty that it was better to just take it out of the truck. The only thing it is missing is the EGT probe and that can be purchased from EDGE for $30.00.

I am thinking $450.00 shipped. PM me if interested.
 

fishn2dmax

Well-known member
Why Sell it?

Tell your D.W. , by law, simply installing an aftermarket device doesn't void your warranty!!! if you use common sense and don't abuse you truck by using the higher "race" levels and you'll be fine. I've had a juice edge box on my duramax from day one and have taken my truck in for warranty work many times and never a concern by the selling dealer ( in fact the dealer installs juice edge boxes for its customers).

When taking my truck into unknown dealers ( out of town or traveling), I simply remove my juice box and attitude controller ( mounted with velcro) The pyrometer probe is still installed, but that by itself can't give them a reason to deny warranty work. My juice box has paid for itself many times over on level one. I have documented a 10-15% increase in fuel mileage. When towing, I use level 2 and nothing higher to avoid high egt's and stress on the tranny.

As long as you use the edge box with common sense ( don't use it for racing) you will not have a problem with Warranty and federal law is also on your side.
 

ChopperBill

Well-known member
I have the edge on my "03". Truck pulls the Bighorn SO much better in the hills on level two that I wouldnt even consider a new truck right now. When they take my Juice away I will follow up in a pine box.
 

Niles

Well-known member
Gotta say it, buy a Dodge and you don't need it!! Just for FUN!!!!NoneNoneNoneNone
 

NewCyclone

Active Member
Okay, you guys are starting to make me reconsider.

One issue and reason it scares my wife is on the last long haul (659 miles) we took with the TT the EDGE kept screaming at us because of EGTs hitting 1350. We where towing in level 2, which I now understand is not meant for a heavy load. Eventually our truck went into reduced power mode. Once we cleared that the truck told us to clean the exhaust filter immediatly. We went through this cycle for about an hour. Finally I just disconnected the whole thing at a gas station and came the rest of the way home stock.

I will admit that I loved the product when I was not towing and it showed good MPG gains. However, I am not sure what is going on with the emissions. These new trucks and there DPF filters I think are interfering. Anybody else with these problems or recommendations before I think about hooking this back up?
 

creeper

Well-known member
The manufacture can certainly void your warranty for mods and they are doing so in an alarming rate. The box makes your truck operate in a way it wasn't designed for. YOU pay if you PLAY. All they have to do is say NO, then you have to hire and attorney and experts to say otherwise.

The diesel forums are FULL of voided warranties for boxes. The new fords now have technology that will register if you hook up a box and remove it for service(as many guys do). No more hiding by simply removing the box. Ford has also added in new truck literature, If you mod your truck your warranty can be voided. My dealer told me flat out, DON'T MOD the truck as any big repairs have to be authorized by Ford first.

YOUR WIFE IS A SMART LADY. LISTEN TO HER.

These new diesels have been having hard enough problems with the emissions stuff, why throw in some half baked program for a few MPGS or a little more power. 10K+ for a new engine is a lot of duckets if it's on you.

Did you know they can void your warranty for hauling over the GVWR of the truck??????
 

creeper

Well-known member
Why Sell it?

Tell your D.W. , by law, simply installing an aftermarket device doesn't void your warranty!!!

When taking my truck into unknown dealers ( out of town or traveling), I simply remove my juice box and attitude controller ( mounted with velcro)

These two statements really don't make sense and don't support each other. IF in FACT it doesn't void your warranty, then why remove it at all?

The Fact that you are removing, shows you are aware you can be denied.

You play, you pay. 10k or more for a new engine is not my idea of fun.

You couldn't give me a juice box unless it's grape flavored.

Some interesting tidbits from Edge's site:

it is very difficult for most people to hire an attorney and fight a voided warranty. It is for this reason that Edge recommends always disconnect and remove your module and monitor when you take your vehicle to a dealer for warranty work."


Disconnect it ??????? Wonder why??? Common sense tells you that even edge knows that your warranty can be voided.

How they void your warranty: They simply say NO, sorry we voided you warranty because you modded it. Will that be Visa or Master Card?

How you get them to cover the truck under warranty: You hire an attorney for thousands of dollars, you hire an expert who is familiar with these new engines and the box you use, for thousands of dollars. You go to court while your truck sits in the dealers lot for months. Judge decides who's right. Probably cost you 10k just to fight and they know it, plus you really can't prove either way the box did or did not cause your piston to melt or crack your block. Your expert says it's not the boxes fault, the engine maker says it did. Then it's still on you.

IF you like gambling with a 50k truck, then get the edge. For me I'll get there a little slower, use a few more gallons of fuel and sleep at night knowing my warranty is intact on this VERY EXPENSIVE engine.
 
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fishn2dmax

Well-known member
The Magnuson-Moss warranty act protects consumers from companies for denying warranty simply because of aftermarket add on - unless such aftermarket add on can be proved to have caused harm.

Simply having an edge juice box or any chip installed on a truck does not constitute a reason ( legal) to deny warranty.

The above said, the reason I remove my juice box when visiting "unknown" dealers was to simply avoid any possible warranty denial issues. Even though I would likely win my case if a dealer refused my warranty for just having a chip or box installed, I would have to invest a lot of time and up-front monies for legal costs. The best overall method is to just remove the box ( very easy to do) before visiting a " unknown" dealer for warranty work.

I have an earlier LB7 duramax version, so I don't have any of the new emission controls and urie tank. In my case the juice box gives me the power of the new generation engines, without all complexities of the new emission controls. With the new latest generation duramax engines, it does appear there is less performance to be gained with a juice box than with the eariler generation duramax engines.
 

creeper

Well-known member
The Magnuson-Moss warranty act protects consumers from companies for denying warranty simply because of aftermarket add on - unless such aftermarket add on can be proved to have caused harm.

I hate it when guys say this and apparently have never even read the Act.

1. The Magnuson-Moss Act assures you have a warranty in place.

2. The Magnuson-Moss Act had absolutely NOTHING TO DO WITH or even APPLIES to an aftermarket edge box.

3. The Magnuson-Moss Act protects you from being forced into buying things like Oil filters, oil , air cleaners,brakes, head bolts and other REPLACEMENT items from Ford , GM or Dodge. Or what the act refers to as TIE IN SALES. When you can get the same items and specs from after market.

It also gives remedies on warranty problems.

If it's in your warranty, which it has been in nearly all the warranty stuff I read, that damage caused by modification or alteration of systems can void you warranty, then you're pretty much out of luck if the $15 an hour wrench turner says, yup the box burned the piston. That's all it takes on their part, that's their proof.

Look under your What is not covered section of your warranty. It's that thing in the owner manual that no one usually reads.

Now of course just installing it MAY NOT void the warranty, you have to actually suffer some damage. That's why they are now setting a recorder in the computers to document if you install a box or not. For newer trucks you can remove the box , they still got you now.

You can gamble and "maybe" nothing will happen. But, melt a piston with a box installed and see what happens.

There are Voided warranties due to guys using performance air cleaners as they are not the same "specs" as factory air cleaners. Mechanic finds dirt in turbo, says your K&N filter isn't up to specs and that replacement turbo is on you.

Ford tried to blame my engine problems on me because I do my own oil changes. They said , IN A HEARING, that I used the wrong oil and that is the reason my engine was leaking. Pretty smart on their part as there were no service records for my vin... I smiled and pulled out my receipts for motor craft oil and motorcraft oil filters paid in cash. They looked pretty stupid.

You play, you pay.... For safety, piece of mind and for the OP to get the wife off your back. Keep it stock and enjoy the fact that neither one of you have to lose sleep that you engine my detonate and you'll be looking at a 10k+ bill to fix.

Enjoy the 100k warranty....
 
Creeper

Good read and attention to detail. I have a 2005 f350 crew cab long box. I purchased the truck with the intent of buying a 5th wheel. That was nearly 2.5 years ago. I am just finally getting around to buying the 5th wheel.

Anyway to get to the point, I own my own business, so the tax man said buy a new truck so you can have a write off, when I went to buy the truck the dealer talked me into leasing the truck....still dont know if that is a great idea, but they said will you pay $490/month vs $780/month to buy, and at the end of 5 years will will still owe about 18k on the truck and if you dont put more than 11.5k miles/yr on it and take good care of it, it will be worth 20-21k at that 5 year time, so the truck will be worth more than you owe and you can trade it in or lease another one. I only have 18.5k miles on the truck, so I guess I will see how I come out on the lease thing in another 2.5 years. I change my oil about half the time and let the dealer do it the other half and keep all my records so they will be complete at the time to trade it in.

When I got the truck everyone was telling me I should chip it and change the air filter, but I was not really tempted just because of what you said. I noticed in another post of yours you said you have the ford by default for weight purposes and you have had 2 lemons and something about the dealer denying your warrantee because you used the wrong oil.... Just curious about what years your lemons were and what troubles you have had. And how do you like the 2008 with 6.4 diesel? Not a seconds trouble with my truck and I am looking forward to see how it handles the 5er. I have a 16 ft boat I plan on pulling behind the 5er on occasion and that is why I opted for the 350 vs 250 and the long box.
 

creeper

Well-known member
My lemons where both 6.0 Diesels. The first one was a 2003 and the second was a 2006. Both had nearly identical problems, leaking oil, fumes in cab, turbos giving up their lives just to name a couple.

The 2008 is a nice truck with exception of the MPGs and the mysterious tapping sounds lots of us are having.

If you go to the diesel forums it's not hard to find people with voided warrantees or denied warranty work. The number one reason, yup, performance boxes. Voided warranties are no secret and my dealer told me, " Don't chip this truck".

There is one guy who had a brand new F450 and modded it with lift, tires, wheel and brought it in with problems. Result, voided warranty. They guy sold it shortly after paying to have it repaired. He provided his Vin on the internet so it wasn't some hoax.

Voided warranties are no urban legend, they are now common place. Do guys do it? Sure do... Does sometimes nothing happen? Sure does... Do guys with boxes get service from sympathetic dealers? Absolutely... Ford now reviews all major repairs and many times ask for the parts to be sent in and examined (my turbo for example). If they determine it's a box watch out.

I know one guy who had a hole in his piston. The blamed a box and he never had one. The only holes they have had in pistons were due to boxes, so Ford denied his warranty claim. Luck for him he had a diligent mechanic who later determined an injector tip broke off and caused the hole. Original estimate to him was 12k, plus labor. This later started becoming common place with the 6.0.

Each guy has to do what his is comfortable with. For guys who chip their trucks with no problems, good for you I'm happy it worked out for you. With my experience there is no way I will chip or overload the truck and I sleep well at night.
 

kakampers

Past Heartland Ambassador
I'd be willing to bet the problem you experienced with your truck was NOT the EDGE unit, but the "scrubber" in the new diesels that caused your truck to go into the "reduced" power mode. It has something to do with recirculating the unused fuel...and it apparently clogs quite easily.

We've used an EDGE on our old 98 Dodge without any issues, and have it on our 05' Kodiak...both pre-scrubber vehicles. We've never experienced a problem with either truck. The Dodge had the EDGE on it for many years and gave us nothing but great service. Oh...and we've never had a problem sleeping at night...
 

creeper

Well-known member
People didn't have as many problems with the older trucks and boxes. Now they have upped the HP as the big three have been in a HP race, now add more power onto that and it could be a disaster.

These MPG tunes are just cutting back on the regeneration cycles, thus better MPGS. It's no wonder it went immediately to a regeneration mode, your DPF was probably full due to reduced cycles.

The engineers who designed the engine are having a tough enough time getting them to work right. Flash after flash after flash. Now add in some half baked, barely tested program and hang on.

Like I said, if it works for you. Good, but it's kinda like keeping up with the Jones. Just because it works well on you pre emissions 98 Dodge , doesn't mean it will work the same on a 2008 emissions choked engine.

Following the advice of guys on the internet saying go ahead and do it on an untested unit could be costly.

Following safe advice and leave it untouched? No potential costly engine repairs.

BTW, when you say "scrubber" are you referring to the DPF or the EGR?

The EGR has to do with recirculated fuel and does no "scrubbing"..

The DPF does "scrubbing", by capturing the soot particles and then pumps in raw diesel fuel and burns the particles at high temps, thus no black smoke from the newer diesels. They are designed to clog and then clean themselves.
 

kakampers

Past Heartland Ambassador
The DPF...lots of people are having problems with them clogging and then shutting things down. The are not working as they were intended in alot of cases. Some people are reporting having to run the freeways for 45 minutes to "clean" these units and reset everything. Lots of info on the Diesel Place forum...

Like I said I also works on my 05 Duramax without any problems too...that's why I think it's the "scrubber" or DPF causing the issue not the Edge unit itself. Since his vehicle is a 2007.5 he'll likely have this problem with the chip...but it's not the chip that's bad...just the combination.
 

creeper

Well-known member
Could also be the Edge adding to the problems that already exist or actually creating new ones.

Edge is an aftermarket company. They don't have open access to the internal computer algorithms. They do it by trial and error. There is one box maker looking for testers, yeah right, lab rat anyone?

Too many variables for me to gamble on a really expensive engine. Bring a chipped truck in with a cracked DPF and that 2k DPF is on you.

Did you happen to see how many guys Boxes are destroying their DPFs on dieselplace? So they remove them. There goes that engine warranty.

You guys have more....... ummm, guts then I do. I like my money right were it is, in my pocket.
 

kakampers

Past Heartland Ambassador
So you don't like chips...we get it. But don't blame a good product for problems that are inherent in the vehicle...Oh and by the way, I'm NOT a guy!!!
 

creeper

Well-known member
When things go bad, is it design problems or chip problem? It's a toss up either way on being able to PROVE with a 100 percent what caused the failure.

A lot of boxes have destroyed engines. On the new truck they are destroying DPF's at an alarming pace. Far from a good product.

If you go to the diesel forums and see a guy with a blown engine, 9 out of 10 times he/she has a box installed. It's kinda of easy to figure out the root cause.

You like chips, I get it. It would be prudent to give the OP the caveats of installing a box and the costs he may incur.

BTW, it was the BOX raising his EGTs to 1350, it's be reported that's the temp when Duramax heads start to warp and melt. Cause, yup the box. He's lucky he didn't melt a piston.

Enjoy your box I wish you luck and hope it never causes you problems.
 

theharveys

Active Member
At 1350 degrees the fins on your turbocharger start to turn cherry red. Any hotter and the fins will begin to lay down...then say goodbye to your turbocharger. It may still spin but will not produce anywhere near as much airflow.
I have a Superchips Gold chip in my 2000 Ford F550 PSD. I also have modified the air intake and have a 4 inch exhaust system on it. I have an EGT gauge and I never let the exhaust gas get hotter than 1200 degrees. I have talked to guys who have chipped trucks and no EGT gauge, and they brag about hauling 20,000 lbs down the highway at 70 MPH...I cannot imagine they get many miles between engine rebuilds.
 

jpmorgan37

Well-known member
Well folks, this is just rehashing the same thing. I don't see any new information or facts coming forth, so I think it's time to close this thread and move on to a new discussion.

John
 
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