Question: Refurb Existing TV or Buy New

Hello All:

Thanks in advance for your thoughts/advice. My question has to do with whether to beef up my existing truck or simply buy a new model. A bit of background in order to provide context:

Two years ago my wife and I began to consider purchasing a fifth wheel and as a result we purchased a 2005 Chevy 3500 Crew Cab LT DRW 4x4 diesel with about 160k miles. The truck was stock with no mods but did have a gooseneck hitch from the previous owner. Fast forward to last fall when we finally decided on a 2014 Road Warrior 425 that we ultimately purchased. After attending several RV shows and speaking with the dealer we were under the impression that our truck would pull the unit with no problem. Then we took delivery and the ride home (from Cincy to Indy) was, to be kind, not enjoyable. The truck struggled up the hills outside Cincy and ran hot but did OK when we hit the flatland of central IN. Finally got it home and began to do some serious research to determine why the truck struggled (note to prospective RV'ers....this is the wrong time to begin your research...take it from me). This is what we found:

The truck is rated as follows:

Axle Ratio 3:73
Max Trailer Weight 12,000 lbs
GCWR 23,500 lbs
GVWR 11,400 lbs

RV GVWR is 18k lbs (dry weight appears to be right at 15k lbs)

I have a friend with the exact same truck as mine but his has SRW that he's modded to pull sleds/race competitively. Due to his advice we took our truck to a diesel performance shop where we had a racing intake, 5" exhaust and a tow chip/tune installed. They also installed a manual +/- shifter to better gear down on larger hills. The HP to the wheels jumped from around 250 to over 400 as a result. Plus it sounds really cool and makes my neighbors wonder why this guy with a loud truck just HAS to live in their neighborhood...which makes me smile of course.

The test came last week when we took our first trip to east TN via Nashville and it performed way better than before. Engine temps stayed at or below 210 (it crept just north of 210 on the return trip while going up a large hill but then cooled once we crested) and trans temps stayed between 180 and 200. Put it in tow mode and had to gear down a few times but generally kept cruising between 50 and 60 MPH.

That one hot moment is what has me concerned though. We have a trip planned to Myrtle Beach next month and while I've towed on some pretty big hills in TN I hear that the pull through the Smokey's (I store the unit in TN and thus will be going through Knoxville toward SC) can be a real bear. I've had a few white knuckle moments towing thus far and the last thing I want is to blow something in the middle of the mountains or put myself or others in danger because my TV isn't up to snuff.

My racing buddy recommended electric fans and an aftermarket radiator if needed to address any heat spikes as well as a racing trans rebuild to handle the larger load on the hills. Air bags are on the list too. Total mods would be about $10k which is a lot less than a new TV. I guess that my question is whether to continue to pump money into our current TV or just go and buy a newer unit with better technology. All the numbers that I look at point to the fact that our truck should pull our unit with easily but it doesn't seem to perform in the same way that I read some here report when pulling similar sized units. While peace of mind is priceless I don't want to spend cash unnecessarily. Anyone out there had a similar situation? Thanks again for any thoughts/advice.

Richie

Get a new/newer truck. At 160,000 miles that's what I would do. Put the money towards a newer truck. The newer models have all the torque you need.

Over the long haul, pun intended, you may be better off with a newer vehicle but, and I say but loudly, many are running their Duramaxs way beyond your current mileage with good results. I am not sure why you are having troubles with power and heat. Many of us are towing heavier loads with Duramax 2500 and 3500s and on long grade mountains here in the west with no heating issues. I would be searching for the heating issue rather than adding fans and radiator. That may not be the problem, if there is one. And 210 on a hill is not hot if it stays there and cools off at the top. Your chip may, in fact be causing higher temps as that increases the EGT's. I would be more interested in what that reading is while climbing over the water temp.

The bottom line here comes down to your peace of mind. If you don't like what it is doing, and don't want to chase problems with more mods and money, then a new truck is the route to take. You and you alone have to be able to live with what you have and how it works.

As you continue pouring money into an older vehicle, remember that the Kelly Blue Book or NADA value still continues to move in a downward direction.

I bet a better gear ratio in the rear end would help more than anything else with pulling power and engine heat. They don't cost much either.

justafordguy said:

I bet a better gear ratio in the rear end would help more than anything else with pulling power and engine heat. They don't cost much either.

Click to expand...

It's a 4x4, s would get pricey as more than just rear end gears would need changed.

MTPockets said:

It's a 4x4, s would get pricey as more than just rear end gears would need changed.

Click to expand...

Yep, it would cost a little more but I do all my own diff work (Mechanic for over 35 years) so it's cheap for me.

The OP could just do the rear and see if that solves his problem before spending the money on the front gear, I'd say less than a grand even paying someone to do the labor.

Great thread:

Does it have Tomax tires?

In 2005 didnt chevy change the diameter of the intercooler tubes to a smaller diameter resulting in over heating under load? I am sure that 2004.5 and 2005 had issues with overheating, check some of the Diesel forums and search 2005 overheating problems. There's a wealth of information out there on this issue. I would try that before dumping a ton of money into items that may or may not be causing the problem.

All the engine work in the world will not change the fact the you are way over GCWR and probably way over payload capacity as well.

The 2005 LLY did have heating problems. I changed the LLY turbo intake to the LBZ intake and did an EGR delete and PVC re route. This helped a lot but did not solve all of my heat problems. I was looking into the add on radiator cooling unit when I decided to bite the bullet and bought a used 2011 Duramax 3500HD dually with 84,000 miles on it. In 2011 Chevy upgraded about everything on their 3500HD pickups to increase towing. I wouldn't get anything older than 2011 and the LML engine. Good luck.

And I miss read the trailer weight. That is more weight than I was commenting on.

And I thought that 12K was low for that vehicle. In-fact 12K is for bumper pull. 5th wheel weight is 16,700/7575 with the 3.73.

It really boils down to your budget. Seems to me that your current truck plus the 10k you're going to spend to "fix" it could get you a pretty good used truck. A new truck would cost more than that. If you like you current truck, I'd try to find the root cause of the problem and fix that. The other goodies may not be necessary. If you've got the new car itch, you'll need to go to the dealer to get it taken care of

This website describes the add on radiator I was considering http://coolertowing.com/

We have a 2004.5 4x4 SLT Extended Cab 3500 DRW GMC, have experienced similar "heating issues" in the steeper mountains. It handles great, otherwise. We're all within towing/weight specs of our current trailer, but know if we want to go much bigger, a newer truck will be part of the equation.

Yes, the diesels have a long life. But all the other parts? Remember it's 10 years old and getting older! More chance of other things failing that will lead to discomfort in the wallet.

Sometimes you just have to cut bait. Throwing more money at a ten year old vehicle is probably not the best investment.


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I have driven the same route with my programmed F250 and it was a cake walk.
The 2005 do have rad capacity problems and it needs to be addressed.
The electric fan works great on a short pull but you need up to 35 HP fan capacity to properly cool the engine. No way it can be done using the power from the alternator.
I have found that by not pushing hard in the hills and not creating excess heat you gain the 35 HP required to cool down if the fan starts.
I had a 6.5L GM Diesel that pulled like a monster if the fan was not engaged. But if pushed it really lost speed in the hills due to cooling fan coming on.
I did experiment with my 6.0L Ford Diesel set at 125 additional HP coming back from Florida and if I pushed it, it did overheat and fan came on more often then before on 87 added HP.
It's all in the driving performance and ability to be able tow heavy and get away with it.
I just shift down and keep the RPM high to create more air flow through the rad and keep the tranny running cooler. You can move a mountain if you take care of you truck. Just don't allow the cooling fan to come on.
I use a Scangauge2 with digital coolant temperature and able to drive under the fan run temperature. And it works, after all pulling heavy is far different then drag racing. You can pull in a hill at 100% torque for miles, while racing its mostly less the 1/4 miles. My longest climb was in Arizona for at least 90 minutes and the fan never needed to come on at 100%.

Something else to consider before dumping more money in on the older truck is things like brake lines, body and suspension, steering system. corrosion of brake lines in pre-2006 Chevys seems to be a problem with sudden failures. I sold my 2003 Silverado last year partly because of all the future maintenance needed in addition to moving up to a crew cab and heavier truck. New features in the 2012 certainly added to the overall easy and comfort of my new truck. Yes, worn/corroded components could certainly be replaced but it still can be a money pit and still not meet your needs.

I had a 2005 2500HD CC D/A SB and it did have a heating issue on loooong steep grades. I did what Lynn did...but I got all the parts free as I was a GM tech at that time. Bought a 2007 2500HD same stuff but a LB. No more heating issues. Both trucks where rated at 22K GCVW. My current truck (see sig) is rated a 22500K for a 5er and has GCVW rating of 30500K because of being 4WD. I personally would not spend any more money on a 10 year old iruck and no matter what you do to it...it will never be "legal" to pull your new 5er. Look for a 2011 or newer 3500 DRW and you will never be sorry.

Hey, thanks for all of the information and opinions everyone. After reading the thread, well...I think I need a new truck. Thanks again.