Cold weather questions

Hello all, I am a newbie RV owner and have questions about cold weather camping. I have read most of the articles on this site but have a few questions of my own. Any wisdom or advice is appreciated. I recently bought a 2016 Landmark Newport. I was going to order one with all the options I wanted but opted for one on the lot and the dealer made all the upgrades I wanted (Onan generator, washer dryer etc...) The only thing I did not get was the Yeti package. I want to camp in colder climates and some day possibly even go full time in this Rv in the colder climates. My big questions are as follows.....Can the dealer install cold weather equipment easily? I know I will need tank pad heaters and the fresh supply line from the tank to the pump needs to be wrapped. Is this a hard install and will it mess up the underbelly and insulation? I know I will also need a heat tape and insulation on my fresh water supply line running into the Udc. That part is easy but is that all I need? Are there other areas to consider insulating and wrapping with heat tape? Will the drain lines be okay if I just dump black and grey every few days and then close them back or will water accumulate in these pipes as well and freeze? I know some of these questions may seem silly to the experienced person but I am far from that when it comes to Rving. I hope to learn from the wealth of knowledge available here. Thanks in advance for you comments. I appreciate it. Please feel free to include anything you feel might be relevant knowledge as well.

Eric
 

danemayer

Well-known member
Hi e_millergy,

A lot depends on how cold you mean. If 28 (F) is the low, you might get away by just running the furnace to keep the underbelly warm. If -30 (F) is what you mean, there's more to do.

Tank heating pads are pretty straightforward to install, depending on the floor plan. Sometimes the black tanks are installed above the gray tanks. That means the tech may have to drop the gray tank in order to install the heating pad. So it's more work.

You're correct that the coroplast will have to come down to get to the tanks and water lines. They'll probably have to cut the rear section to get it down. I'd suggest having them install a 1x4 piece of pressure treated wood across the frame at each cut so the coroplast joint is secure. Screw the coroplast to the wood and then tape the coroplast. Left to themselves, all they'll do is tape across the cuts. You should have them do more.

While the coroplast is down, I'd suggest you have heat tape installed on all the water lines, with a single switch to turn all lines on and off. With the coroplast down, this is easy and the cost is relatively low. 100' roll of heat tape, insulation, and controllers will be around $200 plus the labor to install.

Another thing to consider while the coroplast is down is extra insulation. Get foam board and cut to fit inside the frame members. Tape attic batting to the top surface and then flex it into position in the frame. The frame will hold it in place. It may not fit right under the front tanks, but you can add a lot under the bedroom and living area.

If you'll be in temps below -15 (F), the gate valves may freeze. While the coroplast is down, you should identify the location of each gate valve in case you ever have to drop a corner of the coroplast, or cut an opening to defrost with a hair dryer.

You can prevent a lot of problems in extreme weather with a mini-skirt under the plumbing area. It's easy to construct out of 2x4' or 4x8' sheets of 3/4" foam board and duct tape. Stick a high quality, thermostatically controlled ceramic disc heater in the enclosure and it will keep the gate valves from freezing. Put the heater on a piece of wood to keep it above any melting snow or running water.

We have additional tips in our owner-written Water Systems Winter Usage Guide.

And one other thing: if you have a refrigerator with ice maker, the water feed line may be exposed to outside air. You need to winterize this line and shut it off before temps drop below freezing. If you have the Residential Refrigerator, instructions are in our owner-witten Residential Refrigerator Guide.
 

Birchwood

Well-known member
We reside in our Landmark during the month of October in eastern Canada where temps can go as low as -9 c during the night.We leave the water taps dripping and furnace on during the night.We would never live in our RV during the cold winter months as I feel its unsafe and RVs are not met for winter living.On occasion it may be ok... ie ski trip in US but not up here.
 

caissiel

Senior Member
Last year we stayed in our BC till the 15th of December here in Altantic Canada till we went south. We have no additional heat strips or insulation but the fresh water tank drain is inside the coroplast. We do have the dual pane windows.

It was very comfortable but I dought its worth it for the cost of Propane does not make sence. one night took 30lbs of propane to keep the furnace going. It was way below 0F but nothing froze. We Leave around the 15th of November every year and we live in the unit full time with no problem but heat cost.
 
Thanks for responding. Any info is appreciated. My plans are to move back to my home state of Missouri and live fulltime in my Landmark. It can get down to -5 but not often. Most generally the morning temps from Dec 1 to March 1 are in the teens and 20's with daytime highs around 40. I assume that is cold enough to freeze pipes in the underbelly even though it is heated. Therefore I believe if I buy the tank pad heaters and wrap all fresh water lines with heat tape I should be okay. And if needed I can make an under skirting to help as well. Do you think that would be okay? I am surprised to see some people claim to be in 0 degree weather without heat pads and heat tapes on their pipes. Maybe Rv's are built better than I give them credit for. I am still a little confused on what exactly I need to do to make sure I don't have major issues. Thanks again for any help.
 

GOTTOYS

Well-known member
In my opinion, you will have a lot of problems trying to keep warm in near zero temperatures. RVs just are not made for that type of weather on a long term basis. You might get away with it for a few days but I think you will need a plan B. The cost of propane will be more than the cost of renting an apartment. It would not be unusual to go through a 30# tank in a day or two...Don
 

danemayer

Well-known member
We've spent anywhere from 6-10 weeks at a time in Breckenridge, CO with our 2011 Landmark for the last 5 winters. We do have dual pane windows which reduce heat transfer a bit. We've also added insulation in the underbelly.

The first season, we just refilled our 40# propane tanks and went through 2 tanks per week. In recent years we've had Amerigas set up a 125 Gallon external tank with bulk propane pricing (around 1/2 of the tank fill pricing).

Last winter I think we spent a bit over $300 on propane for 10 weeks, plus the tank delivery and pickup charges.

It's much colder in Breckenridge than in Missouri. Temps sometimes get to -30 (F) and are frequently well below 0 overnight. Last winter was relatively mild for the Colorado mountains.
 

TravelTiger

Founding Texas-West Chapter Leaders-Retired
If the daytime temps get above freezing, you'll likely have less issues keeping the underbelly warm. Water doesn't instantly freeze at the second the air hits 32 degrees. Prolonged time below 32, and even lower wind chill, is a concern.

We found in our ski trips to Colorado, if the daytime temps were above freezing, we had no issues overnight keeping the belly warm.

Last year, with one of the coldest winters in a long time (more than 50 days with freezing temps) we were living in our coach during the winter in the easternmost part of west tx.

Lowest temps over the winter were probably in the 20s, and rarely stayed below freezing for more than 24 hours, but we had more days like that then in recent years. We do have added tanks pad and pipe heaters, and used a heated hose, plus a drop light behind the basement wall.

We did not have to wrap the hose. We used a small styrofoam cooler over the water spigot. We did not skirt the trailer. We did go through a lot of propane, as our ElkRidge is not as well insulated as some of the higher lines. We used an extra heater in the bedroom, and the fireplace, for supplemental heating inside.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

How-ie

Member
Newbies with a 2016 Heartland Pioneer. We are hooked on RV'ing. We had planned to winterize the camper for the months of Dec - March. We live in N. Carolina and after being out in the camper, we do not want to give up our weekends. The Pioneer has an enclosed underbelly but it is not heated. Our main concern is the outside shower. It hasn't stayed very cold for long here at the coast but you can never tell what Mother Nature will do next. Any ideas for the newbies to continue our weekends will be appreciated.

Barbara
2016 Heartland Pioneer
2012 Nissan Titan.
 

jimtoo

Moderator
Hi Barbara,

Welcome to the Heartland Owners Forum and to the family. We have a great bunch of folks here with lots of information and all willing to share their knowledge when needed.

I'm sure some of our members that live in cold weather places will jump in soon with some info for you.

Be sure and check out our Heartland Owners Club. Join us at a rally when you can and meet lots of the great folks here and make friends for a lifetime.

Enjoy the forum and your new unit.

Jim M
 

danemayer

Well-known member
Newbies with a 2016 Heartland Pioneer. We are hooked on RV'ing. We had planned to winterize the camper for the months of Dec - March. We live in N. Carolina and after being out in the camper, we do not want to give up our weekends. The Pioneer has an enclosed underbelly but it is not heated. Our main concern is the outside shower. It hasn't stayed very cold for long here at the coast but you can never tell what Mother Nature will do next. Any ideas for the newbies to continue our weekends will be appreciated.

Barbara
2016 Heartland Pioneer
2012 Nissan Titan.

Hi Barbara,

You have two different concerns: how to manage low temps on the weekends while using the trailer, and also how to prevent damage during the week when not using the camper.

Taking the second problem first, you might want to get an air compressor. If you wrap up your weekend by using the compressor to blow the air out of the water lines, and you drain the tanks, and water pump inlet bowl, you can protect the water systems without repeatedly putting antifreeze through the system. After a few times, you'll get pretty good at it and it'll probably only take 20-30 minutes. Take a look at our owner-written Winterization Guide.

Protecting the water system while using the camper is going to be more about how cold it gets than anything else. If you're dealing with lows in the mid-20s (F), running the furnace will probably keep everything from freezing. Depending on location, you might want to add a drop light near the water pump. Your sealed underbelly may get some heat from the furnace - most trailers with sealed underbellies do, but I'm not sure about the Pioneer.

To protect the outside shower, you may want to install cutoff valves on the water lines feeding the shower. They're easy to install. Here's a link to one. After you evacuate the water, close the valves for the winter. Reopen them in the Spring.

Also take a look at our Water Systems Winter Usage Guide.
 
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