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pegmikef
12-31-2016, 07:42 PM
Woke up this morning, went outside and saw a small pool of hydraulic fluid under the generator compartment (where the pump and manifold are located). Also my doorside rear jack was retracted and the middle jack retracted about an inch. I have not used the system since our return on the first of Dec.

After much searching I found the line that apparently has a pinhole in it. I extended the jacks again and after 15 minutes there was a two inch diameter spot of fluid on a paper towel I put under the suspect line. The amount of fluid looked bad on the driveway, but apparently was a not whole lot looking at what is remaining in the reservoir. I think it has been leaking for a while and finally got to the point where it found a way out of the generator compartment.

Ok, here's my dumb question (that I think I know the answer to).

Is there any way to patch or splice the line or do I have to replace the whole line?

There is plenty of room to work in the generator compartment. I am hoping for a temporary fix that would last until Goshen so I could just arrange with Heartland to repair it and some other stuff. Thanks for any info.

Doublegranch
12-31-2016, 08:12 PM
I would not use this as a permanent fix but at the National Rally in Goshen I picked up some "rescue tape", have never used it so not sure it really works...they claim it will seal hydraulic lines, radiator hose, etc..
You can pick it up online....just a thought until you get around to replacing the line.

pegmikef
12-31-2016, 08:22 PM
I would not use this as a permanent fix but at the National Rally in Goshen I picked up some "rescue tape", have never used it so not sure it really works...they claim it will seal hydraulic lines, radiator hose, etc..
You can pick it up online....just a thought until you get around to replacing the line.


Thanks. You don't happen to know the psi rating do you? I saw one online that was 950 psi, but I don't know what the psi of the fluid is under pressure (e.g., jacks extended with weight on them).

danemayer
12-31-2016, 08:24 PM
Mike,

If the problem is isolated to one hose - the one that feeds the door side mid and rear jacks, you might be able to retract all the mid/rear jacks and then see if the leak persists while using only the front landing gear. You may be able to get close enough to level using front gear only until you get it fixed.

But I don't know whether Heartland would be prepared to fix something like that as one of the 2 minor repairs at the rally. And getting into the service center isn't a sure thing.

But Lippert may have a service center that could easily take care of it if you schedule now.

Btw, I deleted the other thread.

Doublegranch
12-31-2016, 08:35 PM
Mike:

I have no idea what the psi rating is on the rescue tape....sorry

jbeletti
12-31-2016, 09:11 PM
Mike, I don't think the rescue tape will hold under the hydraulic pressure.

Consider removing the line and taking it into a shop to have another made of the same length.


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HornedToad
12-31-2016, 09:16 PM
Call Hosepower.com, they have a shop in San Angelo. They came to my location in a mobile service truck and made / installed a custom replacement hose on site in about an hour for around $100http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170101/445b22c60efc573535a013b83141fd33.jpg


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pegmikef
01-01-2017, 10:15 AM
Mike,

But I don't know whether Heartland would be prepared to fix something like that as one of the 2 minor repairs at the rally. And getting into the service center isn't a sure thing.

But Lippert may have a service center that could easily take care of it if you schedule now.

Btw, I deleted the other thread.

Dan, my thought was to schedule an appointment with Heartland before the rally and have the work done as I have a dead week or so before the pre-rally week.

What other thread? I had two? If so, I must have hit something twice.

- - - Updated - - -


Call Hosepower.com, they have a shop in San Angelo. They came to my location in a mobile service truck and made / installed a custom replacement hose on site in about an hour for around $100


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Thanks Mike. Earlier, I did a search and for some reason Hosepower didn't come up. That would be perfect and probably more cost effective in the long run.

porthole
01-01-2017, 12:48 PM
This is just one example of the many types of splices that can be used to patch a hydraulic hose (and rescue tape isn't one of them).

http://www.tools-plus.com/coilhose-phs0406-dl.html?gclid=Cj0KEQiA7qLDBRD9xJ7PscDCu5IBEiQAqo3B xNus_iDbjs7-4zdQOk2y_PafVum6RyuXGHSY27jD0v4aAqyx8P8HAQ

And here is another option

http://www.pirtekusa.com/on-site-hose-service/

pegmikef
01-01-2017, 05:55 PM
Thanks Duane. Appreciate it, but since Hosepower is here in town, I'm just going to go with them as they are only about a mile away.

HornedToad
01-02-2017, 11:17 AM
Mike,

My leak was about an inch from the fitting on the left rear jack and I thought they could easily splice it. The Tech told me that he need about three feet of free line to get his crimping tool on the line. Since my underbelly is riveted I told him it was OK to cut a slit in the coroplast to feed the line back through the frame rail and down through the underbelly to use his crimping tool.

When the Tech dropped the line that was leaking it was the one that crossed the 8 ft over from the right rear to the left rear jack. He decided it was easier / better to make / replace the line instead of trying to splice it. Now if it was a line that ran from front to back a splice would have been the way to go.


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pegmikef
01-02-2017, 05:43 PM
Mike,

My leak was about an inch from the fitting on the left rear jack and I thought they could easily splice it. The Tech told me that he need about three feet of free line to get his crimping tool on the line. Since my underbelly is riveted I told him it was OK to cut a slit in the coroplast to feed the line back through the frame rail and down through the underbelly to use his crimping tool.

When the Tech dropped the line that was leaking it was the one that crossed the 8 ft over from the right rear to the left rear jack. He decided it was easier / better to make / replace the line instead of trying to splice it. Now if it was a line that ran from front to back a splice would have been the way to go.


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Mine runs front to back, but it angles over to the doorside jack in front of the tires. Because of the damage I have found, I'm just going to drop the coroplast and replace the whole line (see next post). I went out to hosepower today after the gym, but they were closed for the holiday. I have been in the bolt and tool store next to them, but never noticed their store. Thanks again for the tip.

pegmikef
01-02-2017, 05:58 PM
Still leaking, but after cleaning everything up I found the culprit. The offending line is routed right along the seam in the middle of one of my battery boxes (poor design as it turns out). There is a marked discoloration of the portion of the line for about a foot right along the area that is next to the battery box. I had never noticed this before as the line is pretty much out of sight. I can flake part of the outer layer off with my fingernail.

My thought is that when the batteries are charging (off an on, most of the time) there is an acidic combustible vapor produced. Even though the battery boxes are vented, they are by no means air tight along the seams. I figure three and a half years of the line being exposed to this vapor weakened that area of the line until it succumbed to the pressure and in its weakened state, burst. That would explain why I had the pool of fluid and the retracted and partially retracted jacks.

Although it is a super PITA, I'm just glad that it happened at home and that it was caused by a discernible problem and not because my lines are reaching their end of life.

I would advise anyone that has my model of Big Horn (2013/2014 3010RE) with the factory installed level up to check their hydraulic lines in the generator compartment.

pegmikef
01-03-2017, 05:22 PM
Please Help.

I lowered the coroplast, located the offending line (down the driver's side, then crosses over to the door side middle jack), and called " Hosepower" to get it fixed, and their response was "oh, we no longer do that at this branch." They will make the new line for me if I take it in. So it looks like I am in the hydraulic line replacement business even though I know nothing about hydraulics (lowering the coroplast was probably half the job.

I have watched several youtube videos regarding line replacement, but they are all for heavy equipment or tractors. One thing in common was making sure there was no load on the hydraulics.

I plan on performing the following steps to replace the line.

1) Hook trailer up to my tow vehicle.

2) Retract all the jacks (slides are already closed).

3) Disconnect line from jack. Then disconnect line from manifold.

4) Fish line out of trailer.

5) Fill wheelbarrow with money and go get a new custom made line.

6) Fish line from the jack to the manifold.

7) If there are o rings involved, I will replace those and then reconnect the line.

8) Fill reservoir to my fomer fill mark and extend and retract all jacks several times to expell air.

9) Add fluid as required to reach the fill mark.

10) Extend landing gear and disconnect from tow vehicle.

11) Reinstall coroplast and sewer hose tubes.

12) Have a well-deserved adult beverage or two.

Thanks in advance for any advice or criticism of my plan.

avvidclif
01-03-2017, 05:50 PM
Shop around. A lot of places make hydraulic hoses including some NAPA stores. You might save some money. Also add the Anti-Stiction fluid while the system is open. Search "leveling jacks popping". All sounds good....

HornedToad
01-04-2017, 02:43 PM
Mike,

I wish I could offer some advice... but step 12 is the only one that I have much experience with!!!

I do remember when they serviced my trailer I went inside for about 30 minutes and the Tech had completed steps 3, 4 & 6,
so it didn't take too long, and hopefully you'll only need a wheelbarrow if you pay with pennies.

I didn't notice notice any discernible drop in the fluid level after I extended / retracted the jacks several times... so I skipped steps 8 & 9,
and had already added the Anti-Stiction fluid.

We can practice step twelve again in Alpine... Good Luck with the repair!!!

aRAYwego
01-04-2017, 11:01 PM
Please Help.

I lowered the coroplast, located the offending line (down the driver's side, then crosses over to the door side middle jack), and called " Hosepower" to get it fixed, and their response was "oh, we no longer do that at this branch." They will make the new line for me if I take it in. So it looks like I am in the hydraulic line replacement business even though I know nothing about hydraulics (lowering the coroplast was probably half the job.

I have watched several youtube videos regarding line replacement, but they are all for heavy equipment or tractors. One thing in common was making sure there was no load on the hydraulics.

I plan on performing the following steps to replace the line.

1) Hook trailer up to my tow vehicle.

2) Retract all the jacks (slides are already closed).

3) Disconnect line from jack. Then disconnect line from manifold.

4) Fish line out of trailer.

5) Fill wheelbarrow with money and go get a new custom made line.

6) Fish line from the jack to the manifold.

7) If there are o rings involved, I will replace those and then reconnect the line.

8) Fill reservoir to my fomer fill mark and extend and retract all jacks several times to expell air.

9) Add fluid as required to reach the fill mark.

10) Extend landing gear and disconnect from tow vehicle.

11) Reinstall coroplast and sewer hose tubes.

12) Have a well-deserved adult beverage or two.

Thanks in advance for any advice or criticism of my plan.

I just replaced an elbow fitting for the LF landing gear at the manifold last weekend. I also did step 1 in connecting my trailer to the tow vehicle. Everything went great but then I realized after finishing that hooking up the truck was a step I didn't really need to do. I could have retracted the landing gear fully without the tow vehicle attached. Being in an rv park, I wouldn't have had to partially block the road in front of our space. Oh well, Live n learn. On the plus size, I did find a good source for all things hydraulic. I bought the same part at discounthydraulichose.com for half the cost that Lippert wanted to charge after shipping, etc.

pegmikef
01-05-2017, 05:30 PM
I just replaced an elbow fitting for the LF landing gear at the manifold last weekend. I also did step 1 in connecting my trailer to the tow vehicle. Everything went great but then I realized after finishing that hooking up the truck was a step I didn't really need to do. I could have retracted the landing gear fully without the tow vehicle attached. Being in an rv park, I wouldn't have had to partially block the road in front of our space. Oh well, Live n learn. On the plus size, I did find a good source for all things hydraulic. I bought the same part at discounthydraulichose.com for half the cost that Lippert wanted to charge after shipping, etc.

Thanks for the info. Since I am going to be crawling around under the front end that is all supported by the hydraulic jacks, this is more of a safety precaution than an actual requirement to change out the line.

In any event, the hydraulic line replacement project is kind of on hold until Monday or Tuesday when it warms up out (went from 70 to 30 the other night and expected to hit low twenties). I had to open the slides so I can run the furnace to keep the under belly halfway warm (I'm not big on winterizing since I keep it connected to electricity . . . empty the tanks and H/W heater).

aRAYwego
01-05-2017, 06:54 PM
Thanks for the info. Since I am going to be crawling around under the front end that is all supported by the hydraulic jacks, this is more of a safety precaution than an actual requirement to change out the line.

In any event, the hydraulic line replacement project is kind of on hold until Monday or Tuesday when it warms up out (went from 70 to 30 the other night and expected to hit low twenties). I had to open the slides so I can run the furnace to keep the under belly halfway warm (I'm not big on winterizing since I keep it connected to electricity . . . empty the tanks and H/W heater).
I get what you're saying, I hate the cold. As far as the safety factor, I figure if all the legs are retracted fully, the trailer can't go any lower unless the the axles fall off. I would never lay under it with extended jacks being the only support. Fully retracted though, the bolts in the jack to frame position would have to all fail. Just my thoughts.

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avvidclif
01-06-2017, 12:17 AM
Mike,

I wish I could offer some advice... but step 12 is the only one that I have much experience with!!!

I do remember when they serviced my trailer I went inside for about 30 minutes and the Tech had completed steps 3, 4 & 6,
so it didn't take too long, and hopefully you'll only need a wheelbarrow if you pay with pennies.

I didn't notice notice any discernible drop in the fluid level after I extended / retracted the jacks several times... so I skipped steps 8 & 9,
and had already added the Anti-Stiction fluid.

We can practice step twelve again in Alpine... Good Luck with the repair!!!

Amen on the first and last line. Step 12 it is.....

pegmikef
01-09-2017, 12:28 PM
Here's a couple of items I found in the library of Heartland Owners Manuals under the "Tools" tab. I called Lippert to verify the PSI and was told that 3000 is the max that the pumps they use are capable of producing. I need the information to get a replacement hose.

On edit. The note in the manual (second photo) is incorrect. The hose I removed (installed by Heartland) is one quarter inch inside diameter (ID), not one half inch as stated in the note.

pegmikef
01-10-2017, 07:27 PM
Nice weather today so I disconnected and fished the broken line out of the trailer (19.5 feet) and had a new hose made which I will install tomorrow and after testing and put everything back together. I did notice that the new hose is considerably stouter than the one I remove. Here's a picture of the damaged section of the line. See if you can guess where the line burst and which part was routed along the battery box.

jnbhobe
01-10-2017, 08:32 PM
Did you pull a fish line when you when you pluued the old line out Mike ????

pegmikef
01-11-2017, 09:53 AM
Did you pull a fish line when you when you pluued the old line out Mike ????

No. I had already dropped the coro-plast so I could see the whole thing. The way it was installed in the hangers with the other lines it was much too tight to use a pull line. I had to push the hose on one side of the hanger with one hand while pulling the hose on the other side with my other hand. There are two such hangers, plus the area where it goes through the frame.

pegmikef
01-11-2017, 05:41 PM
Installed the new hydraulic line today and it works great. I am going to leave the system under pressure overnight to make sure I didn't induce any other leaks or problems. If all is good in the morning I will put everything back together. The hardest part of this whole job is getting the old line out and then threading the new line in. The connections are simple using a 9/16th open end (no O rings involved).

Does anyone know what Heartland uses to seal around hoses and wiring that go through the frame? Is it just spray foam insulation or is there a special compound for that purpose?

Terry H
01-11-2017, 11:14 PM
Mike, I use Pond Sealing Foam (https://www.lowes.com/pd/smartpond-Black-Pond-Foam-Sealer/3066381) to seal gaps and holes in the frame.

pegmikef
01-12-2017, 09:42 AM
Mike, I use Pond Sealing Foam (https://www.lowes.com/pd/smartpond-Black-Pond-Foam-Sealer/3066381) to seal gaps and holes in the frame.tru

Thanks Terry. As soon as Peggy gets back from the gym I'll have run me to Lowe's (truck's still hooked up until I am finished under the trailer).

pegmikef
01-12-2017, 06:45 PM
After being under pressure overnight, I found no traces of leaking hydraulic fluid anywhere in the hydraulic system and found no other problems so I reinstalled the coroplast and sewer hose tubes. Now all that is left to do is close the batteries up and reload essential junk back into the generator compartment. Now that it is done I am glad I did it myself as I learned a lot about my trailer and how things (especially hydraulic system) are installed and that I can probably make other repairs that I probably would not have tried otherwise.

I did learn that if you are working by yourself, reinstalling the coroplast is really a challenge and that an impact wrench is a must.. I ended up using a floor jack and eight foot 2/4 to help hold it up.

All in all, it was a labor intensive inexpensive project. The tools and materials I used were:

Impact wrench with 3/8 inch socket and extension.
Razor knife (for cutting coroplast as needed).
9/16 inch open end for hose fittings.
Needle nose pliers with wire cutter (for cutting and tightening wire ties that hold the lines).
Creeper, large piece of cardboard (used both) or any other ground cover for working under trailer

Custom made replacement hydraulic hose $39.00
Gap sealing foam for resealing frame holes 5.00
Heavy duty black wire ties to replace the cut ones . . . on hand.
RV Belly Repair Tape . . . on hand

danemayer
01-12-2017, 07:23 PM
Mike,

When you removed the failed hose, was there any fluid pressure? Did the hose drain easily? Did you have to purge air from the new hose?

pegmikef
01-13-2017, 08:47 AM
Mike,

When you removed the failed hose, was there any fluid pressure? Did the hose drain easily? Did you have to purge air from the new hose?

No pressure, just the fluid that remained in the line where it was lower than the leak. It drained very easily. and only a couple of drops came out of the fittings on the jack and the manifold. It was the return line from the door side middle jack and was routed across the trailer and then along the frame with the other lines, through the generator compartment wall to the manifold mounted on the right side of the generator compartment as you face it from the front. The line was 19.5 feet long. I had the new one made shorter and rerouted it so it is not next to the battery box seam.

On the air, yes had to purge it. I had read on this forum and saw on you tube to fill the reservoir to the correct level then cycle the system a couple of times to force the air out and fill the line. I did just that and then had to add a little more fluid to the reservoir. Overall, between the fluid that leaked and that needed to fill the new hose, I added just under a quart.

Bobby A
01-21-2017, 10:24 AM
I have a friend that is going nuts trying to find his hydraulic leak in his door side front level up. it seems the hoses are dry but some how leaks onto the foot. Pretty rapidly I might add. Does anyone know of a mobile service hear or near Tampa Florida or more specific New Port Richey Florida. He would rather have a mobile service than to up root. Is there any possibility of a seal gone bad in the leg it self ?? What type of fluid should he be adding ?? Im sure he is pretty low on fluid. He had the Lippert 6 point like most of us do. Thanks everyone.

TedS
01-21-2017, 12:02 PM
He might be lucky and have a loose fitting at the top of the cylinder or unlucky and have a rod seal leak.

Top up the fluid with ATF, automatic transmission fluid.

pegmikef
01-21-2017, 07:21 PM
I have a friend that is going nuts trying to find his hydraulic leak in his door side front level up. it seems the hoses are dry but some how leaks onto the foot. Pretty rapidly I might add. Does anyone know of a mobile service hear or near Tampa Florida or more specific New Port Richey Florida. He would rather have a mobile service than to up root. Is there any possibility of a seal gone bad in the leg it self ?? What type of fluid should he be adding ?? Im sure he is pretty low on fluid. He had the Lippert 6 point like most of us do. Thanks everyone.

How about the fittings where the hose connects to the jack. All my jacks have elbows on them and the hose connects to the elbow. An earlier poster on this thread mentioned that he had to replace an elbow. If your friend can have somebody else retract and lower the jack while he watches the fittings he might see it leak. On mine the black lines are the extend lines and the orange are the retract lines. Since the line at the jack is probably higher that the rest of the line it may only be leaking when it is under pressure. I used the "menrose" ATF recommended by Lippert as I don't have the "popping" problem so I didn't have to use that other stuff recommended earlier in this thread.

Bobby A
01-25-2017, 09:26 AM
How about the fittings where the hose connects to the jack. All my jacks have elbows on them and the hose connects to the elbow. An earlier poster on this thread mentioned that he had to replace an elbow. If your friend can have somebody else retract and lower the jack while he watches the fittings he might see it leak. On mine the black lines are the extend lines and the orange are the retract lines. Since the line at the jack is probably higher that the rest of the line it may only be leaking when it is under pressure. I used the "menrose" ATF recommended by Lippert as I don't have the "popping" problem so I didn't have to use that other stuff recommended earlier in this thread.

O.k. thanks everyone, didn't mean to hijack this thread, just trying to help out a friend.