HELP Please

Ok, need help. I boondocking. Was running on gen and everything fine. Was running the microwave and fireplace and both shut off. The gen two breakers did not trip. Fuses are good. Shut down restart and nothing. The gen does not power up the unit. Appears the batts are not charging either so I don’t have much time. What could it be? Thanks in advance.

So the generator runs, and the circuit breakers on the front of the generator have not tripped.

Have you checked the main 50 amp breakers in your main circuit breaker panel?

Have you checked other outlets around the coach to make sure they're all dead?

If everything is really dead around the coach and the main breakers inside the coach aren't tripped, the next stop is the transfer switch - probably located behind the rear wall of the pass through basement storage. Be very careful working around the transfer switch. The generator supplies enough power to seriously injure or kill.

To keep the batteries charged while trying to figure things out, connect the trailer to the truck and run the truck for 10-15 minutes every hour or two. Disconnect the truck when not running so you don't run down the truck batteries.

50 amp good, everything dead around coach except for running off batt. Into transfer I go, never been in there.

BE SURE THE GENERATOR BREAKERS ARE NOT TRIPPED. Turn them off then on manually just to be sure. Same with other breakers. Sometimes tripped breakers are hard to see. If you have any regular outlets on the generator, try plugging a 110 volt device into those outlets.

Good luck!!!

Thanks, did that but still nothing

Ok, I know little of the operation inside transfer box. From what I know I’m looking for a tripped switch. Looking inside, I don’t see an obvious switch. I got a green little light which is not lite.

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I have two big contractors and a green light on side, but where is the switch I need to throw that is probably stuck?

There are no circuit breakers or manual switches inside. One end of the box has 2 sets of 3 wires. The other end has a single set of 3 wires. The inside of the top cover identifies what's what.

If the transfer switch senses >106 V on L1 (in this case on the wires from the generator), the contactors should operate with a loud thunk. You'll need a voltmeter to find out whether the wires from the generator are delivering 120V AC. With cover off, generator running, VERY CAREFULLY check voltage: L1 to Neutral = 120V and L2 to Neutral = 120V, L1 to L2 = 240V. If the wires from the generator read ok, check for the same voltages on the output side of the transfer switch.

Ok, no physical stuck switch. So if all else above checks out, one of the switch contactors went out? Fair to say? I left my meter at home....good place for it now.

Could be a board failure that keeps the contactor from activating. Could be interruption of power between generator and transfer switch, could be bad contacts, could be a problem on the backside of the circuit breaker panel.

You really need a voltmeter to figure out what's going on.

Thanks all. Well I terminated the trip. I back home this morning and hey, I found my meter I left at home. LOL Now I can figure things out. Thanks again

If problem is truly in the transfer switch, the main element here is simply a very large relay (contactor). Relays are simply electrically operated electrical switches - pairs of electrical contacts making and breaking. If you can access the contactor, or remove it from the housing, you should be able to get a flat swiss file or electrical contact burnisher onto the contact faces to repair the arcing damage which is most likely causing your problems. I would also recommend a spray of Caig Cramolyn DeOxIt contact cleaner/restorer on each of the 3 contact sets.

I think a new 50 amp transfer switch is in the area of $150. Check E-Bay.

I manage my campground hookup and leaving procedures such that there is 0 amp load on the contactor relay contacts. I turn off my inside mains breakers before connecting/disconnecting from shore power. This causes all of the load contact arcing to be on the breaker contacts. I bought a spare double mains breaker at Home Depot (about $10) and carry it with me. I have yet to have to replace it. Replacing the mains breaker inside the trailer is much easier (and much less expensive) than replacing the transfer switch in the crawl space.

Well after testing the gen contactor, the Hot 1 from the gen is 119V, Hot 2 only 2.3V. I contacted the Cummins Service Center I’ve always dealt with and they said bring in to them, it’s still under warranty. Dropped it off today.

I agree with you WDK.

alwaysbusy said:

Well after testing the gen contactor, the Hot 1 from the gen is 119V, Hot 2 only 2.3V. I contacted the Cummins Service Center I’ve always dealt with and they said bring in to them, it’s still under warranty. Dropped it off today.

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Glad you found the problem, thank you for sharing your troubles since it will certainly help someone else down the road.

alwaysbusy said:

Well after testing the gen contactor, the Hot 1 from the gen is 119V, Hot 2 only 2.3V. I contacted the Cummins Service Center I’ve always dealt with and they said bring in to them, it’s still under warranty. Dropped it off today.

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What you've found is certainly a problem, but doesn't explain the total failure inside the coach. With 119V on L1, the contactors should have operated and the power from L1 should have been available to some outlets and devices in the coach.

Is it possible the 119V was on L2 and the 2.3V on L1?

Spot on Mr Dan. I typed it backwards, L1 was 2.3v, L2 was 119v. Sorry. I learning here, can you explain why some things should work if it was opposite? I understand the incoming two prongs but what's the difference down stream in wiring?

Thanks again for your help the other night. Was in the middle of nowhere, no one around, in a forest open field....oh yes, in the dark in 40 degrees. Aggravated w/o my meter with no batteries charging off gen. Worst part, my dinner was in the microwave still not warm as the microwave went off with everything else, so I was hungry too. I was a Mess and a half which I'm sure everyone can relate to. Without my gen, staying was pointless.

If L1 has correct power, the contactors will attempt to actuate. Assuming they do, the power from L1 will be passed to the L1 breaker in the main panel inside the coach, and the power on L2 will be passed to the L2 breaker in the main panel.

The L1 and L2 breakers in the main panel are the 50 amp breakers that are tied together, physically operating as one unit. Heartland uses more than one type of breaker panel, but the one you have probably has the 50s on the left side, and a bunch of 15 and 20 amp breakers as you go to the right. The first 15 or 20 amp breaker is getting power from L1 and the second from L2. Third from L1. Fourth from L2. And so on.

So if there had been sufficient power on L1 to actuate the contactors, power from L1 would have flowed to the L1 breaker in the main panel, and on to all the breakers associated with L1. So half of your stuff would have worked.

But since your L1 from the generator was the problem, the transfer switch was unable to operate.

Btw, if you had your meter with you and had been able to run this down before leaving, a workaround would have been to swap the positions of the L1 and L2 wires from the generator as they go into the transfer switch. And since the Power Converter is a critical function, if that happened to be on L2, you could switch that breaker with one on either side to get power to the Converter and charge batteries, run 12V stuff.

alwaysbusy said:

Ok, need help. I boondocking. Was running on gen and everything fine. Was running the microwave and fireplace and both shut off. The gen two breakers did not trip. Fuses are good. Shut down restart and nothing. The gen does not power up the unit. Appears the batts are not charging either so I don’t have much time. What could it be? Thanks in advance.

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Possibly a transfer switch.

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danemayer said:

If L1 has correct power, the contactors will attempt to actuate. Assuming they do, the power from L1 will be passed to the L1 breaker in the main panel inside the coach, and the power on L2 will be passed to the L2 breaker in the main panel.

The L1 and L2 breakers in the main panel are the 50 amp breakers that are tied together, physically operating as one unit. Heartland uses more than one type of breaker panel, but the one you have probably has the 50s on the left side, and a bunch of 15 and 20 amp breakers as you go to the right. The first 15 or 20 amp breaker is getting power from L1 and the second from L2. Third from L1. Fourth from L2. And so on.

So if there had been sufficient power on L1 to actuate the contactors, power from L1 would have flowed to the L1 breaker in the main panel, and on to all the breakers associated with L1. So half of your stuff would have worked.

But since your L1 from the generator was the problem, the transfer switch was unable to operate.

Btw, if you had your meter with you and had been able to run this down before leaving, a workaround would have been to swap the positions of the L1 and L2 wires from the generator as they go into the transfer switch. And since the Power Converter is a critical function, if that happened to be on L2, you could switch that breaker with one on either side to get power to the Converter and charge batteries, run 12V stuff.

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So in essence, the L1 is the primary of the two and can work alone but not vis versa which makes sense to me now. Thanks

Ok, I have no shame and will be the first to tell on myself so don't laugh too hard with me.

On the cold dark evening of the power failure I physically opened the junction box between the gen and transfer and was about to undo and redo the wiring nuts when I said to myself, "self" the wiring has worked for 84 total generator hours and you have not changed anything since owning so why are you doing this? So back on went the face plate w/o delving into it.

So today Cummins calls me. No problem with the gen. Whoever wired the junction did a poor job. When stripping a wire going to the transfer they cut into the wire thereby reducing the gauge. Nonetheless, they wired her up with a nut. The poor connection was good enough to last 84 hours, but then on our trip gave way. It conducted enough heat to melt the nut and eventually break the wire resulting in our loss of power.

The take away? Never assume that just because the wiring has worked flawlessly for hours, it didn't somehow fail. In this case, the wire job was faulty from the manufacturing floor. I just thank God it did not start a fire somehow. Now back to where I began above....why did I take the face plate off again? Yep, kicking myself in the rear.

The cool part is, Cummins documented this as such and are willing to speak with Heartland over the faulty wiring. I have sent it to Mr Ron in warranty in hopes they might find it in their heart to cover it under good faith given the circumstances. Since not a gen problem, I covered out of pocket.