Lipper Warranty - pinbox movement

I am so sorry to hear of your troubles. When you noticed that your pinbox was sinking into the body was it while you were traveling. We recently took a trip from OH to SC and I noticed that it appeared the pinbox would bounce about a 1/2 inch or so into the body. Maybe I just did not notice it before. Does anyone notice this? I know the nose and under the bed is a molded surface and not really attached except at the seams. Now though I am concerned. HOW DO WE KNOW IF WE HAVE A TWO YEAR WARRANTY FROM THE DATE OF MANUFACTURE OR THE DATE OF PURCHASE? DOES HEARTLAND KNOW HOW WE CAN TELL? Who ever heard of a warranty from the date of manufacture. That is crazy. I hope Lippert does the right thing. We are all watching. If any one out there can help me understand the slight bouncing movement I see please reply. My one year bumper to hitch warranty is up in about two weeks.

lhetsler,

I don't have any answers for you other than I suggest you contact Heartland Customer Service on Monday morning to speak to them about your concern and to get it logged in your file. Have your VIN ready to give to them. The number is 877-262-8032.

Jim

lhetsler said:

I am so sorry to hear of your troubles. I hope Lippert does the right thing.

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HA! You are kidding me, right?

Good luck with the two warranty part, we had a landing leg go bad, everything we saw in writing said a two year warranty but when we contacted Heartland who in turn contacted Lippert the rep for Lippert stated that there is a 1 year warranty and always has been 1 year, so the repairs were on me. ( so much for having it in writing) Not to impressed with Lippert.

lhetsler, I am not sure that your post was meant for me or not but what brought my attention to the pin box on my trailer was the front of the pin box angeling upward and the molding around the pin box being lifted upward with one of the screws having pulled through th molding placed around the pin box that covers the cut in the underlay around the pin box. As Jim stated Heartland can tell you the date of manufacture on your trailer

Jburks said:

Good luck with the two warranty part, we had a landing leg go bad, everything we saw in writing said a two year warranty but when we contacted Heartland who in turn contacted Lippert the rep for Lippert stated that there is a 1 year warranty and always has been 1 year, so the repairs were on me. ( so much for having it in writing) Not to impressed with Lippert.

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This is exactly what Lippert told me yesterday on the newer Heartland products. Our's being a little older WAS covered for two years. Wish I had an extra 5 million, I'd start a new axel/spring company to give Lippert somebody to compete with.

Sorry to hear. I already commented on Goldenwingers post about similar problem..

boatdoc said:

This is exactly what Lippert told me yesterday on the newer Heartland products. Our's being a little older WAS covered for two years. Wish I had an extra 5 million, I'd start a new axel/spring company to give Lippert somebody to compete with.

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Maybe things are changing...the landing gear on my 09 Sundance is Not the Lippert brand.

Goldenwingers said:

lhetsler, I am not sure that your post was meant for me or not but what brought my attention to the pin box on my trailer was the front of the pin box angeling upward and the molding around the pin box being lifted upward with one of the screws having pulled through th molding placed around the pin box that covers the cut in the underlay around the pin box. As Jim stated Heartland can tell you the date of manufacture on your trailer

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So the pin box (steel plate) angles forward when there is no weight on it? Maybe get a 4' long 4"x4" under the pin and lower the landing gear to test for movement. I would not trust the repair shop for one second! ... The remark they made stating the axles were bent worries me as new axles aren't straight and have an arch bend from the factory.

westxsrt10 said:

So the pin box (steel plate) angles forward when there is no weight on it? Maybe get a 4' long 4"x4" under the pin and lower the landing gear to test for movement. I would not trust the repair shop for one second! ... The remark they made stating the axles were bent worries me as new axles aren't straight and have an arch bend from the factory.

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Interesting .The arch in the axles are common. A friend owns a trailer place and the 6000 and 7000 lb axles he has are arched. I have not really looked at mine on the Sundance as it's at the dealers for warranty work. I have seen bent axles and you can tell the difference.

Frame warranty

Hey Goldwingers, I was looking for a response from you. Thank you for your quick response. You are having a more severe problem than I. Indeed I am not sure if I even have a frame problem. I did a test where I put a piece of tape on the body and stretched tight to the top of the pin box and then set it down on my truck and sure enough there was a movement of about 3/4 of an inch. I called Heartland and documented this. I can't get an appointment at my dealer until May 20th and my bumper to hitch warranty is up May 8. Heartland indicated that it would be no problem and that they were documenting it in my file. I called Lippert and as you said they stated that the warranty used to be 2 years from the date of manufacture. This changed on June 1, 2008. Any frame manufactured from that date on is warrantied 2 years from the date of purchase. Mine was manufactured on October 18, 2007 so I am still under warranty until October 18, 2009. You can get your date of manufacture from Heartland by giving the last eight of your vin# I called Heartland back after talking to Lippert and the Heartland guy said he does not agree with the guy at Lippert, that it wouldn't make sense if a unit sat on a dealer lot for a year and a half or more, one could buy a unit and have little or no warranty on the frame. This is almost unbelieveable, a frame should last the lifetime of a unit. The heartland guy agreed and stated that if manufacturer came out with a 10 year warranty frame, Lippert would change their posturing in a hurry. I hope things work out for you in the end. I know you will survive and still enjoy your RVing lifestyle. I really don't blame Heartland, except that they should require more of their frame builder. But, I guess Lippert doesn't have enough competition. Best wishes and thank you for your postings. I would not have had mine checked without reading of your problems. I will let everyone know how mine turns out when I get it back probably in June. I would be interested in knowing how much flexing of the pin box seems to be normal for others. MAYBE A 3/4 INCH FLEX IS NORMAL. It doesn't seem that it would be normal though.

lhetsler said:

Hey Goldwingers, I was looking for a response from you. Thank you for your quick response. You are having a more severe problem than I. Indeed I am not sure if I even have a frame problem. I did a test where I put a piece of tape on the body and stretched tight to the top of the pin box and then set it down on my truck and sure enough there was a movement of about 3/4 of an inch. I called Heartland and documented this. I can't get an appointment at my dealer until May 20th and my bumper to hitch warranty is up May 8. Heartland indicated that it would be no problem and that they were documenting it in my file. I called Lippert and as you said they stated that the warranty used to be 2 years from the date of manufacture. This changed on June 1, 2008. Any frame manufactured from that date on is warrantied 2 years from the date of purchase. Mine was manufactured on October 18, 2007 so I am still under warranty until October 18, 2009. You can get your date of manufacture from Heartland by giving the last eight of your vin# I called Heartland back after talking to Lippert and the Heartland guy said he does not agree with the guy at Lippert, that it wouldn't make sense if a unit sat on a dealer lot for a year and a half or more, one could buy a unit and have little or no warranty on the frame. This is almost unbelieveable, a frame should last the lifetime of a unit. The heartland guy agreed and stated that if manufacturer came out with a 10 year warranty frame, Lippert would change their posturing in a hurry. I hope things work out for you in the end. I know you will survive and still enjoy your RVing lifestyle. I really don't blame Heartland, except that they should require more of their frame builder. But, I guess Lippert doesn't have enough competition. Best wishes and thank you for your postings. I would not have had mine checked without reading of your problems. I will let everyone know how mine turns out when I get it back probably in June. I would be interested in knowing how much flexing of the pin box seems to be normal for others. MAYBE A 3/4 INCH FLEX IS NORMAL. It doesn't seem that it would be normal though.

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I became curious so i measured the pin flex on my Sundance 30'5", at 1400lb pin weight. I have 1/2" of flex and thats with the front water tanks empty. I used a 4' tall transmission jack on the pin then raise it till the landing gear was loose. I would think 3/4" is fine on your longer heaver unit. I know my truck frame is rated to have 1/2" deflection at full load. I'm hoping Goldwingers problem is related to the collapsed side being over weight. I noticed while jacking up the pin that my slide side landing gear as quite a bit more weight on it.

Heartland should forget the politics and fix their unit under the 2 year warrenty!

Pin Box Flex

Thanks for your response. Maybe mine is okay then. I will have the dealer check it just in case. I suppose with hearing about the Goldwingers problem a little paranoia might have set in. You are right with what we pay for these units it should be a Heartland warranty period. Maybe things will change. Apparently Lippert was getting flack or they wouldn't have changed to the two year warranty from the date of purchase instead of the date of manufacture in June 2008. They must have been getting pressure from the manufacturers.

I agree that Lippert Components are suspect at best. On my ,09 3670, the electric motor for the rear stabilizers failed when it got water inside the motor. It was not sealed. Heartland replaced it but it should not have failed for that reaon if it had been properly sealed when manufactured. While on the road, my right front jack failed. I left the rig hooked to my truck and pulled the jack out and disassembled it. I discovered that the thrust washer under the crown gear had split in half and dropped out. Fortunately I had a good washer in my supplies box and was able to repair it while miles from any help. They should consider using 50 cent wahers insted of the 10 cent ones they apparently install at Lippert.

Pinbox movement

I wanted to give everyone an update on my situation. Apparently the movement of the pinbox is normal spring in the frame. I can see where there would have to be some give. The frame according to the dealers investigation is okay. They were in contact with heartland. I did discover that on the off door side the shocks were barely a 1/4 inch from the tire and was concerned that they would wear on the tire. The dealer called today and said heartland was having new axles manufactured for my rig. I guess there was no other way to fix it. The axles should be in within two weeks. Heartland has been real easy to work with. My rig is out of warranty as of May 8, 2009, but I called Heartland in April about these problems to make sure they were documented. I had to cancel a trip out west, but glad we can get this fixed.

lhetsler said:

I wanted to give everyone an update on my situation. Apparently the movement of the pinbox is normal spring in the frame. I can see where there would have to be some give. The frame according to the dealers investigation is okay. They were in contact with heartland. I did discover that on the off door side the shocks were barely a 1/4 inch from the tire and was concerned that they would wear on the tire. The dealer called today and said heartland was having new axles manufactured for my rig. I guess there was no other way to fix it. The axles should be in within two weeks. Heartland has been real easy to work with. My rig is out of warranty as of May 8, 2009, but I called Heartland in April about these problems to make sure they were documented. I had to cancel a trip out west, but glad we can get this fixed.

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They're building you NEW axles?? This is a new one! Keep us posted.
As laid down as the shocks are they serve no purpose except good sounding sales hype. Some just take them off and don't run them because of the clearence problem.

lhetsler said:

I wanted to give everyone an update on my situation. Apparently the movement of the pinbox is normal spring in the frame. I can see where there would have to be some give. The frame according to the dealers investigation is okay. They were in contact with heartland. I did discover that on the off door side the shocks were barely a 1/4 inch from the tire and was concerned that they would wear on the tire. The dealer called today and said heartland was having new axles manufactured for my rig. I guess there was no other way to fix it. The axles should be in within two weeks. Heartland has been real easy to work with. My rig is out of warranty as of May 8, 2009, but I called Heartland in April about these problems to make sure they were documented. I had to cancel a trip out west, but glad we can get this fixed.

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I'm sort of thick headed.....why again are you getting new axles?

New Axles

Yea, I don't quite get it either. But according to the dealer they are manufacturing a new set of axles for my unit. For some reason the shocks almost touch the tires on the off door side. I know the shocks are next to worthless, but the dealer said that was the solution given to him by Heartland. Now if there is anything wrong with the axles themselves I am not aware of it. I will keep you posted. I guess they think the only way they can solve this is to make a longer axle. I would have thought maybe they could install new brackets on the frame and move the shocks over. The springs were pretty flat also, so maybe they decided just to replace the whole kit and kabootle. I am impressed that they are going to this length to fix me up, so I am not complaining. Again, maybe I don't yet have the whole story, but the dealer repeated twice to me that the axles had to be manufactured and we should have them in about two weeks. I wanted him to check the springs also, but he said the axles will come with springs attached. I'll let you know.

Pinbox movement

When I began this thread I was noticing about ¾ inch movement of my pinbox up into the front cap on my 3670. It turns out some flexing of the frame is normal and everything there was okay.

I had also noticed that the shocks on the left side were only about ¼ from the tire and were rubbing the tire in turns. The dealer discovered that the spindles were bent on both axles. Lippert told them that the only way that could happen is from overloading.

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I load only clothes and food. I have only one air conditioner, although I have hookups for two and no washer/dryer, again although I have the hookups. I carry in the basement a fiberglass ladder, a beach umbrella, satellite dish and a few tools and supplies. And most of the basement weight is on the truck. The basement is ¾ empty. I also never run with any water in the tanks.
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The dealer was aggressive and measured the length of the axles on other bighorns he had in stock. Mine were 3/8 of an inch shorter. So Lippert agreed to pay for new axles because of the error in length, at least part of the reason for the shocks rubbing the tires. Wrong reason, but same outcome. I am pleased that Lippert came through even if not necessarily for the right reason. The tires were not damaged.

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Anyway if I am overloaded these axles are under engineered. I don’t know why they don’t put eight or nine thousand lb axles on these. The weight of the 3670 is around 15000. With 7000 lb axles, that is not much for supplies. I know about 2500 lbs or so is on the truck, but still the axles are just barely enough. I hope the quality of axles is better since October 2007 when my rig was manufactured.

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I also had an issue with the breaker shutting down the slides. It turns out the slides were drawing 68 amp with a 50amp breaker. I had printed out the Lippert sheet found elsewhere on this site and Lipperts site concerning putting in an 80 amp breaker and gave it to my dealer. Lippert again came through on this and paid for the new breaker.
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I had put about 4 pumps into each bearing and, you guessed it, blew the seals and grease was all over the brakes, magnet, etc. So the dealer put new brakes, they come already attached to the backing plate, so new pads, magnets and all for $73 a wheel. The didn’t charge any labor since they had to take these off and put them back on for the new axles anyway.

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So, when you add grease go easy. Spin the wheels as you pump to put less pressure on the seals. Lippert says you should repack and replace seals annually. I can’t believe we can’t design a better system to lubricate bearings.

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In all I am happy that the warranty came through for me. I highly recommend Avalon RV in <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com//heartlandowners.org/ /><st1:City alt=</st1:City>Medina <st1:State w:st="on">Ohio</st1:State> if you live in northeast <st1:State w:st="on"><ST1lace w:st="on">Ohio</ST1lace></st1:State>. They really went to bat for me with Lippert to make sure I got the warranty I deserved.

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I am camping at <st1laceName w:st="on">Mohican</st1laceName> <st1laceType w:st="on">State Park</st1laceType> in <st1:State w:st="on"><ST1lace w:st="on">Ohio</ST1lace></st1:State> and am again enjoy my bighorn. I have new axles and brakes so should be good for a while. I have spent about 10 weeks in my rig in the past year in <st1:State w:st="on">Florida</st1:State>, SC and <st1:State w:st="on"><ST1lace w:st="on">Ohio</ST1lace></st1:State> and I still am amazed with the beauty and quality of the interior and for that matter exterior. People come by and the time and comment on what a handsome rig I have. Two different partys commented today as they walked by. One was astonished at the size of the basement. I didn’t bring up the issue of weight.<O></O>
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lhester,

Seven thousand pound axles and springs should be adequate on your 3670. Bear in mind that the pin of the truck takes about 20 to 25 percent of the overall weight of your 3670.

That said, eight thousand pound axles and springs would be nice if you wanted to upgrade to them but I would never suggest anyone go over that. Your unit would be so over-sprung that the ride the trailer would get could be detrimental. I say this not from personal experience but from what I have been told by other seasoned RVers.

Glad Lippert stepped up for you.

Jim