Cheap Heat - RV Comfort Systems

I discovered an add on heat system built and marketed by RV Comfort System - this is an add on unit which is compatible with 30 and 50 amp systems, for both the plenum system trunk line fastened directly to the furnace with floor registers, and the ducted system runs of 4” pipes - I have attached the link for anyone who may want to take a look - given that we are going to full time, I was thinking this may be worth checking in to for our Oakmont.... it would mean freedom from only using propane to heat the 5ver with the added ability to use electric heat through the same forced air heating system.

I am just wondering if anyone has heard of this, or perhaps is using it curently in thier unit....

http://www.rvcomfortsystems.com/index.html

thank you for any comments - safe travels~

I've never heard of it but looks like a Bighorn owner has as there's a Bighorn on their testimonials page. So, it looks like an electric heating system that bolts onto the furnace and uses the furnace fan to blow air through their heater and into the duct work. Pretty cool item. Space and access is going to be the most difficult part of this install. Probably need to add a dedicated power circuit back to the breaker panel for it. But that will be the easiest part of this install. If you end of doing this, please take pictures so you may share them with us and inspire others.

Jim

A really big plus for this system in sub-freezing conditions is that it would provide basement heat. Non-ducted space heaters neglect to put heat in the basement leading to frozen under-floor plumbing (learned by experience full timing in the winter)

I think this unit would be a nice addition to a OEM propane unit from the OEM. It would be nice to buy the rig with an optional electric/propane heater. The concept is great, but I wonder how long it would take to amortize the cost from a retrofit application?

RoadJunkie said:

I think this unit would be a nice addition to a OEM propane unit from the OEM. It would be nice to buy the rig with an optional electric/propane heater. The concept is great, but I wonder how long it would take to amortize the cost from a retrofit application?

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Figure with the installation labor and the cost of the unit, roughly $1500. A tank of propane runs about $30, give or take. So, it equals about 50 refills of a 30lb tank. This does not take into account if your long-term site has an electric meter and monthly bill associated with it.

I have posted a electric heat (underbelly+ interior) system that works for a fraction of that cost if you are a DIY'er. Hopefully Heartland will offer a electric duct heat system that keeps the underbelly from freezing soon for the average user.

I have actually used a small space heater in my basement with great results. I plug it into a Thermo Cube thermostat ( on at 34*, off at 40* ) and let it do its thing.

JohnDar said:

Figure with the installation labor and the cost of the unit, roughly $1500. A tank of propane runs about $30, give or take. So, it equals about 50 refills of a 30lb tank. This does not take into account if your long-term site has an electric meter and monthly bill associated with it.

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If you take in to account the cost of electricity then you have to do some "figuring".

First for the LP furnace, it is either a 35,000 or a 40,000BTU/hr unit. Our cost for Propane at this Campground is $2.60/gal, so the cost per running hour works out to be:


and the "Cheap Heat" units come in 2 outputs, a 307,260 and a 409,680BTU/day. We are long-term so we DO have to pay for electricity ($0.07/kWh). So for the smaller unit the cost per hour is:


and the larger unit is:


But that is now the whole story, since the rating are different lets look at the output per hour and the electric heaters are only putting out a fraction of the BTUs per hour. So if we take into account the fact the electric heater will have to run longer to output the same BTU the cost of the smaller unit changes to:


and the larger unit is:


So you are really only saving $0.13/Hr, and that means that you would have to run the furnace for 6,773 hours or 282.2 days straight just to recover the cost of the basic kit.

If John's estimate is close the to recover the cost of parts and install, it would take 11,538 hrs or 481 days of continuous use.

I like Westxsrt10's, fan mod a lot more.

I think the idea of "cheap heat" is for people that don't have to pay for electricity as it is included in the campsite fee. That is the case for us as we always use electric heat (unless dry camping) so we don't have to burn propane. The fire place, AirV heat strip and a space heater usually work pretty good. On a really cold night we might let a dog or two in the bed

John

I would place an electric heater at the furnace inlet air location and let it rip.
Cost $40.00, payback is very little.

We have installed a light bulb in the basement behind the UDC that we turn on in cold weather to protect everything. We have done this in our last 3 RVs and it works great. Inexpensive to install, inexpensive to run. We put a switch for it in the trailer(with a light so we know it is on).

newbie said:

I think the idea of "cheap heat" is for people that don't have to pay for electricity as it is included in the campsite fee.

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Agree... in our case during the summer our propane tank is a 'pig' therefore the cost per liter makes propane more economical than electricity for the furnace, water tank & fridge.
For the 3 winter months in the RGV where electricity is in addition to our site fees, the cost of propane is very low so again it is less expensive to run these appliances using propane.
The only time that we would see an energy saving with this heater is in parks where electicity is included during the period when we are travel to & from Texas. At the price they are asking not a smart deal for us.

CS

Leave it to the school teacher to come up with the math Thanks for all the calcs Alan. Really puts this one into financial perspective.

While the payback is a tough one, another plus with this system is backup. If you run out of propane, you can still have ducted heat throughout the coach, including the underbelly. If this system has a fail-safe mode where it will run in the event of the propane system fuel run-out, could save-yer-bacon if you are setup for winter camping and are say, away at work or some such.

hey Jim, remember I'm not only a teacher but a mechanical engineer too

One point I did not consider and I do not know if it needs to be or not, is the amount of heat that is blown out of the exhaust port on the furnace. If the electric heater uses the fan in such a way as to not blow a lot of hot air out the exhaust then efficiency of the system increases some. If it dose blow hot air out the exhaust then my comparison is valid.

I remember is TX electricity at one park was a whopping $0.17/kWh and at that rate it would be far cheaper to heat with propane.

2010augusta said:

hey Jim, remember I'm not only a teacher but a mechanical engineer too

One point I did not consider and I do not know if it needs to be or not, is the amount of heat that is blown out of the exhaust port on the furnace. If the electric heater uses the fan in such a way as to not blow a lot of hot air out the exhaust then efficiency of the system increases some. If it dose blow hot air out the exhaust then my comparison is valid.

I remember is TX electricity at one park was a whopping $0.17/kWh and at that rate it would be far cheaper to heat with propane.

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Alan, according to the website, the basic unit costs $880 and they don't sell it retail, only to authorized RV dealers/mechanics. They state about 5 hours to install, so that's in the neighborhood of $500. Figure a markup and incidentals, and $1500 is the approximation. It could be a little less, but I doubt by much.

thank you all so much for your input.... such valuable information as the plan to full time moves forward...

westtxrt10 - can you direct me to your posting regaring the electric heat system that you reference? (sorry, I just cannot seem to find)

again.... thank you all so much for your reply~~

safe travels

L

nextchapter2come said:

can you direct me to your posting regaring the electric heat system that you reference? (sorry, I just cannot seem to find)

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here it the thread
//heartlandowners.org/showthread.php/12665-Added-an-Electric-Gas-heater-switch?highlight=

The last published information I have seen for the propane furnaces in the campers showed them to be 65% efficient. They aren't nearly as efficient as a good house type unit. I know mine exhaust a lot of hot gas out the side. Had anyone seen any information published in the past couple of years? We are current paying 85 cents per pound for propane. If we are staying where the electricity is included then the fireplace and portable heaters come on. Long term you would have to run the numbers.

lwmcguir said:

The last published information I have seen for the propane furnaces in the campers showed them to be 65% efficient. They aren't nearly as efficient as a good house type unit. I know mine exhaust a lot of hot gas out the side. Had anyone seen any information published in the past couple of years? We are current paying 85 cents per pound for propane. If we are staying where the electricity is included then the fireplace and portable heaters come on. Long term you would have to run the numbers.

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Yes, they are not very efficient. I think in the neighborhood of 65000 btu/gallon.

Hay guys here is some Tech info:
RV Gas Furnaces are only 60% efficient (documented fact) because 40% of all of the heat produced goes out the flue. That being said since a gallon of propane puts out 95,000 btu's, but when you figure the flue losses you really only get 56,000 btus per gallon true output.
But with this guys CheapHeat system the electric coil comes after the fire box and it has no flue which makes it 100% efficient. So................ if you do all the math $3.00 a gallon propane would mean you'd have to be paying more than 18 cents a kilowatt hour to equal the cost of propane, anything under that’s a savings on electric.
Not to mention the fact your way more Green and your not having to schlep propane bottles anymore.
Sounds like this guy has a winner to me.
HVAC_TECH