Considering North Trail 24BHS

Gaffer222

Member
We currently have a 2005 Keystone Zeppelin Z11 EZ190 Hybrid that we bought new in 05. We have done extensive research on moving into a TT with queen bed and bunks with a slide. NT 24BHS looks like it fills most of our wants and needs but a little longer than we were hoping for. We have not actually looked at one other than online as it's a new floor plan and not many out there yet. One dealer 1.5 hours away has one on order and should be coming soon. Another dealer 2 hours away has one and we need get over there to take a look. RV wholesalers can order and we have a quote. Hoping the local dealer will come close to the RVW pricing but willing to go 11 hours to OH or have it shipped if price is right.

Our TV is a 2007 4x4 Expedition with HD tow package, 3.73 Rear end. Any opinions on this TT with this TV. I think we will be good, just need to watch the cargo weight on the Expy.

I asked the dealer(over the phone) some of these questions but I never trust a sales guy's answers. Anyone have info on the Pearl Package? It says Upgraded Fiberglass? Is it better fiberglass or just different color? Premium Graphics Package, better quality or just different from standard? Upgraded Black trim, better or just different looking? Does the Pearl package include the painted/molded Front Cap or is that a separate upgrade.

Light Weight Package: HL website says Azdel sidewalls included in this package, is this new to HL/NT or have they been using Azdel for a while. It says sidewalls so I assume the Azdel is only in the 2 sidewalls and not the front, back, roof & floor?

Mattress upgrade: Looks like this goes from standard 74" foam to a 78" pillowtop. I'm 6' so 78" is better. My question is "does the bed frame change" or does it stay the same. Curious if the in stock model at the dealer has the standard mattress can they just order the upgrade or do they need to change the bed frame also.

Any opinions on the upgrade to black fridge insert or leave standard wood grain?

Caliber Edition: Must have for us(love the pull out bumper rack)! Not sure we want or need the power jacks but we will see. I have read some stuff about them bending etc. Any opinions?
 
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danemayer

Well-known member
Hi Gaffer222,

Welcome to the Heartland Owners Forum. There's lots of great information here along with a great bunch of friendly and helpful people.

On your tow vehicle question, you should visit Fifth Wheel Safe Towing to run the numbers on the tow vehicle and trailer, and find out what the issues are, if any.

On your other questions, let me suggest you call Heartland Customer Service at 877-262-8032 / 574-262-8030. Ask for the North Trail Sales Team and they should be able to give you answers you can rely on.
 

mbopp

Well-known member
How many people are you travelling with? Yes, you'll need to watch the payload on the Expy. The length isn't that bad for a BH. My criteria was under 30' for some of the campgrounds we go to.

Pro's and Cons: You may find that the angled kitchen sink doesn't have as much usable counter space as a straight sink. DW didn't like hanging the coffee maker cord over the edge of the counter so I put an outlet underneath the overhead cabinet. We had the dealer add gas struts to the under bed storage access hatch and also remove the fixed pedistals on the kitchen table and add a set of free standing legs. If you look at the overhead doors above the bed you'll see they block access from the side of the bed when opened. I swapped mine side to side so the hinges are now toward the center of the bed. Our Caliber has hidden hinges so I didn't have any holes to fill afterwards. Haven't used the sliding bike rack yet, since it's DW & me the bikes go in the back of the pickup bed. The power stabilizers are take it or leave it, I'd have rather had a slide topper (and may still add one.) DW likes a walk-around bed so the swivel TV wouldn't work for us but you may like the privacy the wall adds. The power awning is nice but I've heard they are not as robust as one with separate legs. We roll ours up at least half way when the wind picks up.

We dry camp so I converted the interior lights to LED's, added dual batteries, and an upgraded converter. Can't comment on the pearl or lightweight packages, they're new since we got ours.
 

Gaffer222

Member
I called Heartland back this morning as they have not emailed or called me back after several attempts.

Spoke to a rep who told me:

They not using Azdel anymore as they had delam problems. I asked if they were back to using Luan and he said they never stopped using Luan. I told him I thought Azdel replaces Luan and he said no Azdel replaces Filon. Either I am confused or he does not really know how their walls are constructed.

I asked about the upgraded mattress being 78" and did the bed frame get adjusted for that. He said the upgrade was just to pillowtop and stays the same as the foam 74". I said the website etc says it's upgraded to a 78" Pillowtop. He said yes it is. I questioned that he just contradicted himself and again he said it will be 78" I'm not confident with his answer.

He said the Pearl package includes a smoother higher gloss exterior(Filon) but was Azdel before they stopped using Azdel(correct me if I'm wrong I don't think this is correct.
I questioned the upgraded graphics, skirt & black trim and diamond plate as stated in the Pearl package description. He said all the North Trails have the same graphics, skirt, trim and diamond plate now. How is this listed as an upgrade and charging extra for it?

This may all sound like I was being rude but I was very polite and just looking for accurate info. I'm not impressed with Heartland's customer service as I am more confused than I was before I spoke with them.
 

danemayer

Well-known member
Were you talking to the Customer Service rep or to a North Trail Sales person? I believe the Customer Service reps handle the entire product line and are assigned to a geographical area. The sales people are specialists who should know their respective products in much greater detail.

If you go to the North Trail page on the Heartlandrvs.com website, look near the top for an icon that says "REASONS TO BUY". You can download a brochure that speaks to the construction. I'm attaching a screen capture from the brochure that shows the multilayer sidewall construction.
 

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Gaffer222

Member
How many people are you travelling with? Yes, you'll need to watch the payload on the Expy. The length isn't that bad for a BH. My criteria was under 30' for some of the campgrounds we go to.

Pro's and Cons: You may find that the angled kitchen sink doesn't have as much usable counter space as a straight sink. DW didn't like hanging the coffee maker cord over the edge of the counter so I put an outlet underneath the overhead cabinet. We had the dealer add gas struts to the under bed storage access hatch and also remove the fixed pedistals on the kitchen table and add a set of free standing legs. If you look at the overhead doors above the bed you'll see they block access from the side of the bed when opened. I swapped mine side to side so the hinges are now toward the center of the bed. Our Caliber has hidden hinges so I didn't have any holes to fill afterwards. Haven't used the sliding bike rack yet, since it's DW & me the bikes go in the back of the pickup bed. The power stabilizers are take it or leave it, I'd have rather had a slide topper (and may still add one.) DW likes a walk-around bed so the swivel TV wouldn't work for us but you may like the privacy the wall adds. The power awning is nice but I've heard they are not as robust as one with separate legs. We roll ours up at least half way when the wind picks up.

We dry camp so I converted the interior lights to LED's, added dual batteries, and an upgraded converter. Can't comment on the pearl or lightweight packages, they're new since we got ours.

It's me the wife and 2 DD's 9 & 11. I believe the payload rating is ~ 1600lbs so subtract the Tongue weight and hitch weight we will need to be careful how much we put in the Expy.

Sound like you have not had many issues with your North Trail and are happy with it?
 

Gaffer222

Member
Were you talking to the Customer Service rep or to a North Trail Sales person? I believe the Customer Service reps handle the entire product line and are assigned to a geographical area. The sales people are specialists who should know their respective products in much greater detail.

If you go to the North Trail page on the Heartlandrvs.com website, look near the top for an icon that says "REASONS TO BUY". You can download a brochure that speaks to the construction. I'm attaching a screen capture from the brochure that shows the multilayer sidewall construction.

I spoke with the regional rep. He did not sound very confident in his answers. I had read the reasons to buy and the rep contradicted the brochure. I questioned the contradictions and his answer was "everything is subject to change"
 
M

Mcreech

Guest
I called Heartland back this morning as they have not emailed or called me back after several attempts.

Spoke to a rep who told me:

They not using Azdel anymore as they had delam problems. I asked if they were back to using Luan and he said they never stopped using Luan. I told him I thought Azdel replaces Luan and he said no Azdel replaces Filon. Either I am confused or he does not really know how their walls are constructed.

I asked about the upgraded mattress being 78" and did the bed frame get adjusted for that. He said the upgrade was just to pillowtop and stays the same as the foam 74". I said the website etc says it's upgraded to a 78" Pillowtop. He said yes it is. I questioned that he just contradicted himself and again he said it will be 78" I'm not confident with his answer.

He said the Pearl package includes a smoother higher gloss exterior(Filon) but was Azdel before they stopped using Azdel(correct me if I'm wrong I don't think this is correct.
I questioned the upgraded graphics, skirt & black trim and diamond plate as stated in the Pearl package description. He said all the North Trails have the same graphics, skirt, trim and diamond plate now. How is this listed as an upgrade and charging extra for it?

This may all sound like I was being rude but I was very polite and just looking for accurate info. I'm not impressed with Heartland's customer service as I am more confused than I was before I spoke with them.



Please let me clear some things up for you, if I could....

1) We did use Azdel for about a year but there was a combination of issues that came up and Heartland decided to go back to Luan behind the fiberglass until we feel confident about going back to Azdel.... And Azdel did replace luan when we were using it....

2) The pillow top Mattress is a longer 78" mattress then our standard 74" mattress but we do not change the bed box size.

3) The Pearl Package is an upgraded fiberglass, Filon is a brand of Fiberglass... Heartland uses Filon 1000 glass and Filon 3000 glass.... The difference is the amount of Gel coat that is in the glass..... The pearl Package uses the 3000 and is at the top of line as far as fiberglass is concerned. This is the same glass that some of our $70,000 5th Wheels use.

4) The graphic package used to be different in the 2013 and early 2014 models but the upgraded graphic package looks so good we decided to make that standard from about Oct 2013 on.... same with the black trimmings.


Also, Flagg RV in MA has a 24BHS on there lot... At least they did last week so please call them before driving.

I hope this helps you.


Mike Creech
 

JohnD

Moved on to the next thing...
Please let me clear some things up for you, if I could....

1) We did use Azdel for about a year but there was a combination of issues that came up and Heartland decided to go back to Luan behind the fiberglass until we feel confident about going back to Azdel.... And Azdel did replace luan when we were using it....

2) The pillow top Mattress is a longer 78" mattress then our standard 74" mattress but we do not change the bed box size.

3) The Pearl Package is an upgraded fiberglass, Filon is a brand of Fiberglass... Heartland uses Filon 1000 glass and Filon 3000 glass.... The difference is the amount of Gel coat that is in the glass..... The pearl Package uses the 3000 and is at the top of line as far as fiberglass is concerned. This is the same glass that some of our $70,000 5th Wheels use.

4) The graphic package used to be different in the 2013 and early 2014 models but the upgraded graphic package looks so good we decided to make that standard from about Oct 2013 on.... same with the black trimmings.


Also, Flagg RV in MA has a 24BHS on there lot... At least they did last week so please call them before driving.

I hope this helps you.


Mike Creech

My warranty is up . . . but yet I'm dealing with warranty issues that I still have that my dealership has swept under the rug . . .

What should I do?????
 

Gaffer222

Member
Please let me clear some things up for you, if I could....

1) We did use Azdel for about a year but there was a combination of issues that came up and Heartland decided to go back to Luan behind the fiberglass until we feel confident about going back to Azdel.... And Azdel did replace luan when we were using it....

2) The pillow top Mattress is a longer 78" mattress then our standard 74" mattress but we do not change the bed box size.

3) The Pearl Package is an upgraded fiberglass, Filon is a brand of Fiberglass... Heartland uses Filon 1000 glass and Filon 3000 glass.... The difference is the amount of Gel coat that is in the glass..... The pearl Package uses the 3000 and is at the top of line as far as fiberglass is concerned. This is the same glass that some of our $70,000 5th Wheels use.

4) The graphic package used to be different in the 2013 and early 2014 models but the upgraded graphic package looks so good we decided to make that standard from about Oct 2013 on.... same with the black trimmings.


Also, Flagg RV in MA has a 24BHS on there lot... At least they did last week so please call them before driving.

I hope this helps you.


Mike Creech

Mike,

Thanks for the info. That clears it up.... and helps a lot.

Azdel really sounded like a great idea to eliminate some of the issues I have heard about/seen with Fiberglass(Filon)/Luan wall construction. If possible, can you expand on the issues Heartland experienced with the Azdel walls? FYI, Azdel is still listed on your website under the light weight package under the Standards & Options tab. I understand that specs etc change on a regular basis and that is why I try to research with calls and emails to get the latest accurate info. Until you responded I was having a difficult time getting answers. I appreciate your help and you taking the time to respond to customers on the forum.

I spoke with Flagg RV this morning and they said they have the 24BHS on the lot. We are hoping get out there Saturday and take a look.
 
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M

Mcreech

Guest
Mike,

Thanks for the info. That clears it up.... and helps a lot.

Azdel really sounded like a great idea to eliminate some of the issues I have heard about/seen with Fiberglass(Filon)/Luan wall construction. If possible, can you expand on the issues Heartland experienced with the Azdel walls? FYI, Azdel is still listed on your website under the light weight package under the Standards & Options tab. I understand that specs etc change on a regular basis and that is why I try to research with calls and emails to get the latest accurate info. Until you responding I was having a difficult time getting answers. I appreciate your help and you taking the time to respond to customers on the forum.

I spoke with Flagg RV this morning and they said they have the 245BHS on the lot. We are hoping get out there Saturday and take a look.


I really cant get into the specifics, some of the problems were us and some where with meterial and now Azdel has a capacity issue... All cars and trucks us Azdel and the car business went from 9 million cars to 16 millions sold over the last 2-3 years.. I also want to let you know that 90% off all TT are still made today with fiberglass and luan.... When there is a problem its usually because the the process when the wall was made.... Heartland makes over 200 walls a day with fiberglass and luan, so we have a pretty good understanding of the process....

I will also get on the web and get that corrected...

Thanks

Mike C
 

Gaffer222

Member
Mike C,

We looked at the North Trail 24BHS today at Flagg RV. The unit had the standard 74" mattress. I measured the distance between the headboard to the pocket doors and there is no way a 78" mattress will fit. Has something changed in the 24BHS build to accommodate the optional 78" mattress since this one was built or is the 78" mattress not an option with this floor plan? Also just a suggestion as this may be a deal killer for us, there is no storage in the bathroom except a small medicine cabinet. The bathroom seemed large compared to most similar floor plans and all the others have at least some storage under the sink. The 24BHS vanity has no door or storage. The unit seems to be interior storage poor compared to similar floor plans by other manufactures. Interior storage limitations and to short of a mattress were really our only issue with this unit. On a positive note the construction quality seems to be much better than most. We had a good experience at Flagg Rv in Uxbridge MA as we were greeted immediately and offered drinks while we waited for the salesman etc. Salesman showed up quickly was not pushy at all. Very nice building, parts store, clean bathrooms etc. The lot was well kept and setup nicely. Can't comment on purchase experience or service but first impressions were better than most!

Thanks
 
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M

Mcreech

Guest
Mike C,

We looked at the North Trail 24BHS today at Flagg RV. The unit had the standard 74" mattress. I measured the distance between the headboard to the pocket doors and there is no way a 78" mattress will fit. Has something changed in the 24BHS build to accommodate the optional 78" mattress since this one was built or is the 78" mattress not an option with this floor plan? Also just a suggestion as this may be a deal killer for us, there is no storage in the bathroom except a small medicine cabinet. The bathroom seemed large compared to most similar floor plans and all the others have at least some storage under the sink. The 24BHS vanity has no door or storage. The unit seems to be interior storage poor compared to similar floor plans by other manufactures. Interior storage limitations and to short of a mattress were really our only issue with this unit. On a positive note the construction quality seems to be much better than most. We had a good experience at Flagg Rv in Uxbridge MA as we were greeted immediately and offered drinks while we waited for the salesman etc. Salesman showed up quickly was not pushy at all. Very nice building, parts store, clean bathrooms etc. The lot was well kept and setup nicely. Can't comment on purchase experience or service but first impressions were better than most!

Thanks

You are correct on the mattress, the 78" pillow top will not fit in this 24BHS. I was just informed by my engineer after I questioned him about it. Sometimes information doesnt alway flow or we start to assume thing. I'm sorry about the confusion. Also, with this particular floorplan, we used every inch of this floorplan, to give you double bunk over bunk, outside kitchen, U-shape dinette and a 40" TV box all in a 24ft living space, that there isn't much room to put the mechanicals.

Please let me know if I can do anything for you.

Mike C
 

JohnD

Moved on to the next thing...
What issue are you having?

The day we picked up our Trail Runner, we were informed that the top outside panels on both sides that run the full length of our TT needed to be removed and replaced as the underlying insulation had been installed incorrectly.

How they knew this I don't know . . . unless this was some sort of known issue with that model.

Three weeks after we picked it up I returned it to the dealership for this repair and a few other warranty issues and it spent three weeks there.

Of course, the awning had to be removed as well as the rain gutters.

Now, the putty that is used to hold the rain gutters and the strip that connects the awning to the trailer has cracked several times since then, allowing water to run under the gutters and down the side of the trailer in several spots.

I haven't found any inside leaks . . . yet.

I've been told here to just put some caulking on it (which is what my dealership called "a warranty repair") . . . but that doesn't really fix the problem . . . but just puts it off for another day!

A day like now where my warranty is up . . . my dealerships' band-aid repairs are not holding yet again . . . and now water is running through those cracks again and down the side of the trailer in several spots.

They have told me that I am now on my own to get this issue resolved.

Yet this problem was started by a not-so-good repair job in the first place . . . which I often wonder if it ever really needed to be done.

Below are two photo examples . . .

The first shot was taken August 31, 2013 (before third fix of this spot) while camping in the mountains . . . second shot was taken March 5, 2014 (three weeks ago and after the last fix of this spot) while parked at my house:

EveDrip-IMG_1355.jpg BadCaulking3-5-2014-IMG_1840.jpg

Our trailer's manufacture date is 4/26/2012 . . . not even two years old yet.

And it looks like this . . .
 

cookie

Administrator
Staff member
One thing that should have been done is that there should have been some butyl rope caulk installed under the awning rail. Then screwed, then caulked.
It sounds like they may have skipped that step when installing the rail and possibly the gutter extension.
If the deal will not make it right, I would remove those installed items and do the job right.
Doing that will most likely save you some problems in the future.

Peace
Dave
 

Gaffer222

Member
You are correct on the mattress, the 78" pillow top will not fit in this 24BHS. I was just informed by my engineer after I questioned him about it. Sometimes information doesnt alway flow or we start to assume thing. I'm sorry about the confusion. Also, with this particular floorplan, we used every inch of this floorplan, to give you double bunk over bunk, outside kitchen, U-shape dinette and a 40" TV box all in a 24ft living space, that there isn't much room to put the mechanicals.

Please let me know if I can do anything for you.

Mike C

OK, thanks for the info. Unfortunately I am to tall to comfortably sleep in the bed the way it is setup. A 74" matress would maybe work for me if there was nothing at the end of the bed. The entertainment center in the 24BHS is to close to the end of the bed. Looks like there is room in the bathroom to make the vanity a little bigger and have some storage. Thanks again for taking the time to respond on the forum.
 
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