Landing Gear Problems (Electrical and Mechanical)

[StrongJava]

Hello--

I have to start off with saying that if it weren't for the people in this forum, I think I would have thrown in the towel by now. I'll skip the rant, but my frustration with this 2008 Bighorn 3670RL coach has about hit my limit.

The questions here might be related to my thread on the 12V DC system: 12V Draw While Driving? Request Peer Review. I'll post a quick update on this other link too so people know what troubleshooting I've completed.

This afternoon, when trying to re-level (front-to-back), I had troubles getting the landing gear motor to run. For a while, it would only retract, but not extend (all 12V DC power drops when the button is pushed.). For a while, a neighbor was helping and while I was trying to get meter readings from the motor leads, it suddenly started working! Elated, I figured I might have determined the real source of my problems (and I still might have): the switch in the landing gear.

It worked for a bit, but then started again to malfunction. In this, I noticed the motor (Venture M-9000-PK) was quite hot. Could this be for a bad switch? BTW, my switch can be pushed and it will stay in place and run even though I think it is designed to spring back to the off position when released.

As I've poked through these forums, it has raised some questions:

1) Many people write about having fuses with their landing gear. I do not see any fuses in this system. Were these added after the 2008 model or am I looking in the wrong spot? In any case, a fuse is not blowing.
2) Some have written about extending the electro-mechanical legs 18 inches. Mine go less than 9 inches. What is the correct spec? I've looked in the Landing Gear Manual (in the HOM section) and the drawing uses the term "stroke" with a value of ~20 inches. Is that how far they should go up and down?
3) In looking through the manuals, I don't see anything that specifically talks about how the switch should be wired up. In my system, the red and black lines running to the motor leads reverse (red to black; black to red) at the screw cap junction. Does the polarity matter here?

In my fine work tonight, I also appear to have managed to break what I believe is a pin that helps hold the motor to the leg, so now the motor flops loose. If I'm reading this right, I've just joined an austere group of users. Are the parts I'll need to fix this readily available?

Thanks in advance for all your help.

Tim

 

[JohnDar]

In regards to an inline fuse on the 3670, it does not exist. I replaced my front jacks and found no fuse. For parts, try the Venture website for starters.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[olcoon]

A couple of years ago, I was having issues on our 2011 Elk Ridge with the landing gear switch. If I remember correctly, it would stop & go, and the switch was sticking and not releasing. I pulled the switch out, and it would work. Got lucky and found an exact replacement and didn't have any problems after that. Don't know what the issue was, but it was taken care of with the new switch. I know we have different rigs built on different lines at the factory, but ours does have an inline fuse that would blow if I retracted the legs too far up. It was kind of hard to find, but I traced the wire from the motor down to the battery.

 

[GOTTOYS]

There is an inline fuse. Mine is behind the battery on an orange wire. I replaced it with an plug in type circuit breaker. If the jacks were bottomed out it would blow a fuse. Now if I am not watching and bottom them out the circuit breaker lets go. After a minute or so it cools down and automatically resets. it plugs in in place of the ruse and is available at most auto parts stores for a couple bucks. As far as the motor. It is attached to the gearbox and is built to move around when in operation. I believe the biggest problem with these jacks is lack of lubrication. They need to be greased at least annually by removing the caps and shooting a lod of grease inside onto the gears and the threaded shaft inside as well....Don

 

[AKDallBH]

I have a 2008 3670RL also. On mine there is no inline fuse. Last year we had both legs replaced. (Frame flex issues).

I also had times where the switch would stick and not return to the neutral. A new switch was an off the shelf item.

I ended up having the system changed with a motor on each leg and a switch for each.

 

[danemayer]

A sticking rocker switch sounds like a problem. You should replace it. Take a picture of the wiring before disconnecting anything. I've attached a generic wiring diagram for this type of switch.

 

[StrongJava]

Good information to help me get going. Having bought a used rig, I'm not always tracking on the right maintenance steps; feel like I'm playing catch up. I had sprayed the legs with lithium grease, but was not aware there are end caps that should be removed to give access to internal gears that should be heavily greased. I'll have to search for those.

I'm pretty sure I don't have a fuse. I've traced wires inside the battery compartment and in the front compartment.

Can anyone comment on the distance the legs should extend/retract by the motor?

I know I broke something in the mount for the electric motor, I just don't know what until I take it apart. As I'm going to try to stop and buy parts today before I take everything apart (and save a couple hours of driving later), I had hoped someone could say "yep, you [almost certainly] need to buy a xxxxxx to fix the motor".

Thanks!

Tim

 

[hoefler]

Check your battery condition and make sure the connections are clean and tight. Low voltage will make the motor run hot, burn the contacts in the switch, blow fuses, burn wires, etc... If your battery is 3 years old or older, you really need to get it load tested, and consider replacing it.

 

[cookie]

Here is a link to the company that made your landing gear. Venture Manufacturing.
You can get all the parts you need there.

Peace
Dave

 

[BlackT]

Tim,
If you need a switch, I have one I can give you. I sent you a PM regarding.

 

[StrongJava]

I'll work on taking out the motor this afternoon and assessing what I'll need. Based on a couple of calls to local stores, parts will need to be shipped so I'll go to the Venture website.

Tom, thanks for the offer. As I said in the PM back to you, the switch was the one part I could procure locally, albeit it without the Extend/Retract labels. As we're an hour North of SA right now, not worth the time and expense of returning it.

Hoefler, the battery is about a year old and I've had it tested twice. I did just buy new cables that I'll put in, but I'm reasonably confident today the problem lies elsewhere. The contributions and ideas are helpful though.

Thanks again to all.

 

[Garypowell]

I'll point out since it has not been yet that switch you need is exactly the same switch that raises and lowers your rear landing gear. I realize you need it too but in an emergency they can be swapped....and I think easier to manually operate the back than the front.

I have been been following your other thread and do believe it might be as simple as a bad ground. Certainly this is more difficult because you are new to all of this.

And, this might be why your rig was on the market.......

keep posting and you'll get through this.

 

[StrongJava]

Thanks Gary, I was not aware of the switches being the same. It looks like one of mine may have been replaced at one time.

Are there different ground points other than these pictured?

 

[danemayer]

Have you followed the heavy battery cable from the negative terminal to its ground?

 

[StrongJava]

Hi Dan,

I have. The cables connect tightly to the buss bar. When I check voltage from any of the hot cables to the buss bar, I get 14.24V. I think that is good, yes?

A thought I had for tomorrow (after I get a new reduction gear box ordered from Venture) is to go buy a 10' segment of wire will alligator clips so I can do a continuity check between the buss bar and the ground wires I showed in the picture below. Does that make sense as a next step?

Tim

 

[danemayer]

Hi Dan,

I have. The cables connect tightly to the buss bar. When I check voltage from any of the hot cables to the buss bar, I get 14.24V. I think that is good, yes?

A thought I had for tomorrow (after I get a new reduction gear box ordered from Venture) is to go buy a 10' segment of wire will alligator clips so I can do a continuity check between the buss bar and the ground wires I showed in the picture below. Does that make sense as a next step?

Tim

The buss bar wires are all 'hot' or 'B+' wires. Continuity to ground is a dead short.

I looked at the earlier picture but couldn't tell what it was showing. Not sure if it was the ground connection for the negative battery terminal or not. But you definitely need to find the other end of that cable and make sure it's got a very good ground connection.

 

[StrongJava]

Hi Dan,

Reposting the picture to make sure our wires aren't crossed (I know, grooooaaaan).

The picture shows two bare copper wires firmly fixed to the metal framing. I, in part, was asking for a confirmation that they are the chassis grounds?

 

[danemayer]

Hi Dan,

Reposting the picture to make sure our wires aren't crossed (I know, grooooaaaan).

The picture shows two bare copper wires firmly fixed to the metal framing. I, in part, was asking for a confirmation that they are the chassis grounds?

I'm afraid I can't tell you what those wires are grounding. But I'd guess that neither is from the negative terminal of the battery. That's the one we all are speculating is a problem.

 

[olcoon]

As far as how far to retract the legs, when we were doing the PDI upon picking it up new, the tech told me about retracting them too far. I had him raise them to what he thought was the max, and put electrical tape at that point. Sometime later, I painted a black stripe around the leg. Unfortunately I can't take a photo, or measure it now, as at the Goshen rally, I had the 3.0 4 point leveling system installed and the front legs were replaced and raising them too high is no longer that much of an issue. I'm thinking the pin was "around" 3" below where the leg goes into the bracket it's mounted in.

 

[StrongJava]

My brain is full

What I know from observation is that the white negative lead from the battery connects with a bus bar used by several other white wires. One of these is a heavier gauge variety, and it leads through the wall into the front compartment and then appears to go through the back wall. I thought it then tied back through to the area behind the basement. Tomorrow I'll tear the contents of the basement out again and try to do a better job of tracing the wires.

In my reading of other discussions regarding RV electrical, some posts seem to indicate there should be a direct ground-to-chassis from the negative battery terminal. Is this what others have? Can someone send me a pictures of their battery compartment?

Tim