Cold weather options - do I need them in my area?

[bobca1]

Hi new to this forum I am close to purchasing a Cyclone 3110 have a couple questions that I was hoping those with winter experience could answer. I live in Southern California so these might seem like ridiculous questions Most of my camping is indeed in fair weather, but I do take trips into the Sierra and Northern Nevada in the winter, and if I had an RV that can handle it, I would use it. I won't be out there if it drops below 0F, but on average its in the teens at night and is not uncommon to see single digit overnight lows. Dealer inventory in my area does not have arctic package or dual pane windows. Should I hold out custom order to get these options or is it overkill based on my needs?
1. Dual pane windows - not sure what the extra cost is because 2 dealers I have talked to discouraged me from getting them, but if extra cost does not break my budget seems to me this would be very desirable to eliminate inside condensation (which I do get in my current toy hauler) and increase efficiency hot/cold climates. I was told that its common for dual panes on RV to leak and fog up customers had issues in the past and they don't want to deal with this issue. Was this a problem in the past? I don't know why manufacturer would offer this option if it was still an issue.
2. Arctic package - was told that since the underbelly on the cyclone is already insulated and heated by the furnace i wont need it. As long as I am staying in and running the furnace I will have no problem with the pipes freezing down to 0F. Seems to me for nominal extra cost I would have insurance against possibility of freezing up, and also not have to run the furnace as much.
Is the dealer giving me reliable information here? I want to believe them... but they also have units in stock they need to sell. So looking for some unbiased feedback from experienced winter adventurers!
I see similar questions asked previously but not exactly in the temp range I am expecting.
Hope to be a Cyclone owner soon!

 

[danemayer]

Hi bobca1,

Welcome to the Heartland Owners Forum. There's lots of useful information here along with a great bunch of friendly and helpful people.

I would say that your dealer's answers reflect a great desire to sell what they have on the lot.

On the Arctic/Yeti package, the key protection is heating pads for the holding tanks. The furnace heat alone is unlikely to protect them down to 0 (F). The Arctic/Yeti package also puts heat tape on the portion of the fresh water feed line that's in the underbelly, which, combined with running the furnace, will allow you to run the pump, pulling water from the fresh tank.

You're correct about minimizing condensation with dual pane windows. They are not the same as residential dual pane windows, so they don't provide as much protection against heat transfer, but they do help. Most who have them feel they also help reduce outside noise. I don't recall any posts here about fogging or leaking, so I don't know why the dealer would have made that comment. And of course, if they don't order trailers with dual pane windows, I have to wonder if they have any experience with them at all.

Here's a link to the MSRP sheet on Cyclone. The MSRP on the windows is $1949 and the Arctic/Yeti package is $899. Of course, you should be able to negotiate a much lower price on these options, especially since it costs the dealer $0 to add them to an order and they don't have to do anything to prepare them when the trailer arrives.

You'll probably need to do a few things to prep for single digit temps. Our owner-written Water Systems Winter Usage Guide has a bunch of tips based on experience of our owners who camp in extreme weather.

Also, if you plan on using the garage as a bedroom or living area, you'll probably want supplemental heat. A high-quality ceramic disc heater would be a good choice. And if your plans include extended cold weather stays, you might find it helpful to have the dealer install a dedicated outlet on its own circuit breaker to provide power for that heater. That way you won't be tripping a breaker when other devices get plugged in on the same circuit.

 

[cookie]

Hello Bobca1.
I recall one frosty morning when I opened the shade on our dual pane equipped Bighorn and the first thing I saw was our neighbor wiping the condensation from the inside of their windows.
We have had dual panes on both of our rigs.
Will not be without them.
I recall only a few posts regarding leakage.
One was was recent on a 2008 model. Another I recall had fogged up but then cleared up on its own.
Definitely worth the investment. IMO.
And yes they do cut the noise.
I don't have experience with the Arctic package but if I planned to spend a lot of time in cold weather I would probably add it. Cold weather means teens or lower.
Good luck on your purchase.
I agree with Dan that the dealer is motivated to sell what is on the lot.
Order what you want.

Peace
Dave

Sent from my awesome Galaxy S5 using Tapatalk

 

[Bob&Patty]

If you want both....get both. BTW, down load the MSRP Dan posted. Add up the options you want, then deduct 20-25% off that price...then go make your deal. A word of advise...order the Goodyear G 614's on your coach. Do not take the chance on the standard "china bomb" tires.

 

[olcoon]

An old adage comes to mind..."It's better to have it & not need it, rather than to need it & not have it." We don't have dual pane windows or the Yeti package on our coach. Have we needed it-seldom, but when it got cold it would have been nice. Last summer we were camped in Arkansas the temps were around 100 & of course the humidity was high, and we only have 1 AC. The temp inside the camper wasn't much difference than outside, I think it was in the 80's inside. While down there we went to an RV dealer kicking tires. We went inside a rig with dual pane & one without. Even with no AC going, you could tell a difference. I'd say if you can afford it, do it. That dealer isn't going to live in the RV, and 6 months down the road he won't remember you, no matter what you do!

 

[bobca1]

Hi All, Thank you so much for the helpful advice and quick replies! This is a great community.
Based on your responses I am going to explore having the dealer order one for me with the dual panes and arctic package. If they can still offer at same discount (I was quoted invoice price on the one they have in stock on the lot).
The only negatives seem to be few hundred extra pounds for the dual panes, and chance of melting through the tanks with the arctic package. I'm ok with the added weight and can keep some water in the tanks.
I know I would regret not having if I overnight up north and things freeze up.
Will let you know how things work out.

 

[bobca1]

If you want both....get both. BTW, down load the MSRP Dan posted. Add up the options you want, then deduct 20-25% off that price...then go make your deal. A word of advise...order the Goodyear G 614's on your coach. Do not take the chance on the standard "china bomb" tires.

Great tip on the tires. I have seen the stories about the damage that can be inflicted by blow outs. How much more does the G rated tires typically add to cost? I did not see a price on the linked MSRP sheets (thank you Dan!).

 

[danemayer]

Great tip on the tires. I have seen the stories about the damage that can be inflicted by blow outs. How much more does the G rated tires typically add to cost? I did not see a price on the linked MSRP sheets (thank you Dan!).

Cy 3110 is shown as having 2 axles, so it should be about the same price as upgrading tires on a Bighorn - around $2300 MSRP for 5 tires.

As a reference, G614s are usually available locally, mounted, for $350-$400. A factory upgrade price, discounted by the dealer to $1,800 - $2,000 is close to what you would pay if you upgraded after purchase.

If you opt for a local tire change, call Heartland Customer Service at 877-262-8032 / 574-262-800 first to verify that the wheels on the 3110 are rated for 3750 lbs / 110 psi. They should be, but good to make sure.

 

[RoadJunkie]

Bobca1, you demonstrate good instincts by questioning the motivation of advise from dealers. If you have the time to wait for a ordered coach, then by all means do it. A great deal of fun can be had by picking colors, options, etc. Execute searches on this forum regarding dual pane, yeti, axles, tires, etc. You will likely find multiple perspectives on each option.

 

[jmgratz]

I would recommend getting both. If you intend on camping where it might get below freezing it is great to have. We have dual pane windows on our present coach and find it does help keeping it quieter and with keeping it cooler in the heat. We have the MCD shades which also help with the heat and cold, and I would recommend them. As far as the Yeti package goes, we use our Yeti (water line heat tape) if it will get below freezing (28-32). If it will be a hard freeze (below 28 for a period longer than 2 hours) we will turn on the tank heaters. Our coach has separate switches allowing us to choose which we want to use. Keep in mind if you are going to use the tank heaters you must have something in the tanks so don't burn a hole in the tank. Since we are normally in the Houston TX area our winter lows are usually in the high 30s to low 40s but there are times it gets lower. A couple of weeks ago it got down to 15 for several hours and the daytime high was 33. We used both the tank heaters and the Yeti. Hope this helps. BTW it also might help increase your resale value.

 

[bobca1]

Cy 3110 is shown as having 2 axles, so it should be about the same price as upgrading tires on a Bighorn - around $2300 MSRP for 5 tires.

As a reference, G614s are usually available locally, mounted, for $350-$400. A factory upgrade price, discounted by the dealer to $1,800 - $2,000 is close to what you would pay if you upgraded after purchase.

If you opt for a local tire change, call Heartland Customer Service at 877-262-8032 / 574-262-800 first to verify that the wheels on the 3110 are rated for 3750 lbs / 110 psi. They should be, but good to make sure.

I am new to RVing had no idea trailer tires could cost that much! 110 psi thats some pretty serious pressure. I'll likely opt to upgrade them later (thanks for the tip will verify the wheels can handle it).

 

[bobca1]

Bobca1, you demonstrate good instincts by questioning the motivation of advise from dealers. If you have the time to wait for a ordered coach, then by all means do it. A great deal of fun can be had by picking colors, options, etc. Execute searches on this forum regarding dual pane, yeti, axles, tires, etc. You will likely find multiple perspectives on each option.

The dealer is willing to work with me to order. They say 6-8 weeks to order, not too bad I can wait that long

 

[danemayer]

I am new to RVing had no idea trailer tires could cost that much! 110 psi thats some pretty serious pressure. I'll likely opt to upgrade them later (thanks for the tip will verify the wheels can handle it).

Another choice would be Sailun S637. Around $200/tire.

 

[bobca1]

Another choice would be Sailun S637. Around $200/tire.

Thank you! Good to know there are lower cost options too.

 

[OEFVET]

How do you know if you have dual pane windows? As stated in earlier posts, they are not like house dual pane windows.

 

[RoadJunkie]

How do you know if you have dual pane windows? As stated in earlier posts, they are not like house dual pane windows.

Close examination will reveal two panels of glass--as opposed to a single panel--that are separated by a very small air gap. Look closely as it can be difficult to determine weather or not there are two panels.

 

[OEFVET]

Thanks, I ordered my rig with dual pane but as you said it is difficult to tell if they actually are on it. How thick should it be?