EXTREAM FIRE HAZZARD! Gray foam insulation.

[MichaelV]

Be very careful with open flames around the gray foam insulation. I caught a piece on fire and it goes up faster than a cube bbq starter. If you are welding or using a flame for heat shrink be careful! If you don't believe me, remove a small piece and try starting it with a match, it burns very fast and completely with lots of black smoke. Imagine being in your coach when that happens? I changed out the size of my fire extinguisher after that.

By the way I have contacted Heartland. Just waiting to hear back. I will keep everyone updated.

Mike

 

[cookie]

Thanks for the heads up Mike. It's important that we all use caution with an open flame no matter if we are in our RV or in our stick and brick house.
Just curious, where on your RV was this foam and how did you manage to ignite it?

Peace
Dave

 

[MichaelV]

Hi Dave
I have a '17 North Trail 23RBS. Every penetration in the chloroplast sheet and thru the floor into the trailer is sealed with this gray expanding foam. I lite it welding on the frame. I have done a lot of welding and have never come across anything like this. I know that home insulating foam is fire resistant.

Mike

 

[Shortest Straw]

Good to know! Is there a better way to seal up the holes than the oem foam? I am getting ready to pull the underbelly to do a bunch of mods and that is my only hold up.

 

[avvidclif]

I had to remove some of the foam sealant around my generator and had heard the Great Stuff Pond and Stone sealer can be used. I checked DOW Chemicals website and it is combustible at 240 deg F. If anyone finds a non-combustible replacement post it.

I got a piece of the old foam I removed and tried to light it. It would burn, black stinky smoke, but as soon as I removed the lighter it sputtered and went out????? Maybe different material, grayish black spray foam sealant.

 

[MichaelV]

UPDATE.... EXTREAM FIRE HAZZARD! Gray foam insulation.

Hi Dave
I have a '17 North Trail 23RBS. Every penetration in the chloroplast sheet and thru the floor into the trailer is sealed with this gray expanding foam. I lite it welding on the frame. I have done a lot of welding and have never come across anything like this. I know that home insulating foam is fire resistant.

Mike

Well its only been about 2 hours and Heartland called me. I told them my concerns and they said that all materials were approved for the rv industry which is what you would expect. I know that the building regulations for homes is different from rv's but I told him that if it were my company and I knew that this product was inferior to the products that were available at your local home depot, I would change just for the safety factor.
The Heartland rep said he is going to bring up my concern at the weekly team meeting tomorrow and run it up the chain so it may take a little time to get back to me. All in all, I like there response. I am sure they get lots of inquires. I think my next step is to record a short video to let other rv owners know about this because I am sure this insulation is used by other RV MFG's.

Mike

 

[RoadJunkie]

There is this stuff, but it's like putting your finger in the dam. The whole rig is not very fire resistant. Get out fast is our motto.

 

[MichaelV]

Right Roadjunky. You can't replace every penetration thru the floor. I removed the Luan covers to the power panel and the one for the water pump, that stuff is 6" deep if you count from below the 2" floor. What really scares me is the black smoke when it burns. Whats in the vapors? On another subject, I am going to find a better way out of that emergency window as I only have one door.

Mike

 

[danemayer]

There is this stuff, but it's like putting your finger in the dam. The whole rig is not very fire resistant. Get out fast is our motto.

Any of you coming to the Goshen Rally should attend Mac the Fire Guy's seminar. If I recall correctly he points out that RVs are 90% easily combustible materials and if a fire starts, the RV will be consumed by flames within something like 1-2 minutes. He has a number of recommendations on fire extinguishers and escape plans/equipment.

 

[RoadJunkie]

On another subject, I am going to find a better way out of that emergency window as I only have one door.

Mike

Oh my gosh, the "Emergency" window. Despite the tragedy of the necessity to do so, the image of almost any one of us, including our dear sweet wives, diving out of a hole in the wall 12 feet above the ground is absolutely hilarious! This thread has motivated me to take a good look at the egress possibilities and work out a family emergency plan.

 

[MichaelV]

That's what I was thinking. Seeing my 60 ah 30 something year old wife crawling out that window in her night wear... well I better have a good way to "push" her out or she isn't going looking like that.

Mike

 

[jayc]

Something I noticed years ago when we stayed a lot in state parks is the large posts that are under the emergency windows. I can just see one of us going out the window onto one of those posts.

 

[avvidclif]

I have given consideration to one of the "Emergency Ladders" sold for houses. They are a rollup rope ladder with 2 hooks that hang onto the window sill.

I did a search and found this one, it's cheap enough I may just go ahead and get it. You realize Murphy doesn't visit those who are prepared?

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00005OU7...nt=&hvlocphy=9026819&hvtargid=pla-83981958326

 

[TravelTiger]

I have given consideration to one of the "Emergency Ladders" sold for houses. They are a rollup rope ladder with 2 hooks that hang onto the window sill.

I did a search and found this one, it's cheap enough I may just go ahead and get it. You realize Murphy doesn't visit those who are prepared?

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00005OU7...nt=&hvlocphy=9026819&hvtargid=pla-83981958326

I picked one up in the clearance section at Walmart. I like you think it can't hurt to be prepared. It's under the bed, up front right by the window. We also have a larger fire extinguisher right by the bedroom door.


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[jjwink]

Any of you coming to the Goshen Rally should attend Mac the Fire Guy's seminar. If I recall correctly he points out that RVs are 90% easily combustible materials and if a fire starts, the RV will be consumed by flames within something like 1-2 minutes. He has a number of recommendations on fire extinguishers and escape plans/equipment.

So glad to see Mac will be there- his seminar is great and so important. We will definitely be attending and getting new extinguishers.

 

[2psnapod2]

Not sure if HL or the rest of the industry will change a product, but this is a great reminder for safety within our RVs. We have never discussed having to evacuate. Much less my wife knowing how to operate said emergency exit window. Looks like it is time for us all to do a little emergency preparedness.

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[wdk450]

Right Roadjunky. You can't replace every penetration thru the floor. I removed the Luan covers to the power panel and the one for the water pump, that stuff is 6" deep if you count from below the 2" floor. What really scares me is the black smoke when it burns. Whats in the vapors? On another subject, I am going to find a better way out of that emergency window as I only have one door.

Mike

After attending a presentation by Mac the Fire Guy at a Heartland National Rally, I bought a chain ladder like apartment dwellers get, and a pillow for sliding out over the window frame. I keep these in the cabinet just above the bedroom emergency window. Hopefully 1) If the fire starts in the most frequent area, the outside compartment of the refrigerator, the self deploying halon extinguisher installed there will quickly put it out 2) The smoke detector will go off early enough to give me time to use the main exit door - it has gone off way too soon from cooking smoke already 3) I MIGHT be able to address extinguishing the fire with the 15 lb. (?) much larger extinguisher I replaced the originally installed unit with.

I retired from working in a major University medical center. Per code wherever wiring, etc. penetrated firewalls, these penetrations were caulked with a RED (silicone rubber?) caulking purported to be highly fire resistant.

 

[JohnDar]

Just so you can compare, the allowable burn rate for exposed automotive interior materials is no less 4 inches per minute per FMVSS 302. Does the RVIA have a similar standard?

- - - Updated - - -

Just so you can compare, the allowable burn rate for exposed automotive interior materials is no less 4 inches per minute per FMVSS 302. Does the RVIA have a similar standard?

I'm also of the opinion that trying to push my wife out the small bedroom window over the dresser, 8 or 9 feet to the ground, is not going to happen quickly, leaving me standing in a cloud of toxic smoke. Best defense are working smoke detectors (dual source) and someone who is a light sleeper (me). I also do a quick check of things before retiring, too. If I'm going to deploy a fire extinguisher, it will be from the outside through the door.

 

[MichaelV]

UPDATE! EXTREAM FIRE HAZZARD! Gray foam insulation.

Well Heartland was very quick to get back to me on Thursday. They informed me that the had taken my concern to management and that their reply was that their is NO "RIVA" REQUIREMENT for a fire resistant foam sealant. I asked that even if was no requirement, wouldn't you want to upgrade to the safest sealant for owner protection? The reply was that he would tell management.

Mike

 

[rahewett]

Cost is the over riding factor here. I believe 3m makes a fire resistant spray foam just like the foam used in the camper but is orange in color. I have used it when wiring houses as it is an approved fire stop. But it is more expensive than great stuff foam. It would be great to see the manufacturers​ step up on things like this but it may have to take some of us sharing our concerns with RIVA to get heard.

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