Possible upgrade in TV? Gas vs. Diesel

[dadtoandrew]

Good Day,

I currently tow my trailer with a 2008 Dodge Ram 2500 Megacab 4X4 with the 5.7L Hemi. I have no issues with the weight of the trailer towing the trailer and the set up is finally working good for me. I am thinking of switching vehicles to a 2008 Ford F250 Quadcab 4X4 with the 6.4L diesel.

The TV is my wifes regular vehicle during the week, and we use it for towing too. She doesn't put on as many miles as I do, so I take the cheaper option for going back and forth to work. I'm not sure if when not towing, it will be working as efficently as it should or not. Will I get it up to good operating temperatures/turbo pressures etc and work the turbo as it should when not towing as a daily driver. I don't want to end up with more problems by what should be a better TV, but "hurt" it by not working it every day as it should be worked. I have heard conflicting issues about working vs. not working the diesel when not towing on a regular basis. BUT, that being said, there are plenty of diesel cars around, and they don't seem to be "damaged" by not putting as much of a load on the engine.

Getting roughly 12 MPG when towing with current TV, which I don't think is really all that bad, considering the weight I'm tugging around. It really drops the speeds on the hills and works the engine hard to keep going up the hill (will not maintain speed, WAY too many RPMs). On some of the hills I usually end up dropping around 15-20 MPH on the hills. Will the diesel be able to better handle the hills, or will it still struggle as much on the hills? Will the MPG's increase with the diesel too? There is a big enough difference in the mileage on the vehicles though. Dodge currently has roughly 100 000 miles on it. The Ford has roughly 195 000 miles on it. Realistically I don't think it's that much on the Ford, as it's not going to be working as hard as the gas model.

We usually end up towing mabye 8-10 times a year with a round trip of anywhere between 300-500 miles each time.

Thanks for any insight on this.

Thanks,
Kevin.

 

[scottyb]

The difference in towing will be like night and day. The diesel will shine in the hills. I have been driving diesel pickups every day fo 30 years. Although, 12 mpg while towing your trailer with the Hemi is impressive. My truck only gets around 13 mpg empty in every day driving.

 

[FiremanBill]

I've been driving my '04 F250 for several years split between my daily driver to and from work, about 10 miles each way, and as my TV for first my 21' bp SOB, then my 29ft 5er SOB, and now my Cyclone.

Won't say I haven't had issues but overall it's been a good truck. Of the probelms I have had I wouldn't contribute any of them to not towing... I did have the obligatory head issues with my 6.0 but I think part of that was my fault as I let her run way to hot on one trip. hard lesson learned there but it was still under warranty so that helped. Other things have just been run of the mill old age stuff, A/C Compressor, fuel sensor issue, ball joints, etc. Just changed the alternator and serpentine belt last night, what a pain that was!

bottom line, I wouldn't hesitate to get a diesel even if you are not towing all the time. And I wouldn't tow anything with a gas engine truck. Real trucks don't have spark plugs! LOL

I see some trucks that never tow a thing... don't understand that but hey, to each their own I suppose.

 

[JanAndBill]

The pulling power and better fuel mileage has been a major advantage of the diesel. However, they have made so many advances in gas engines that, the diesel is no longer the only way to go. You will pay more for a diesel upfront, the cost of maintenance is more, and the price you pay for fuel is more. Even in a high mileage, heavy use application, the payback is very slim. I had the opportunity to visit with a fellow that runs several 1 ton trucks in a "hot shot" freight operation, both diesel and gas. Bottom line, his cost of operation between the two over the long run was running neck and neck. Frankly no more than you are towing, and based on the everyday operation of the truck, gas may still be a better option for you. Unless as my wife says "boys and their toys", you just want a diesel.

 

[sengli]

We recently upgraded from a cheverolet 2500 with a 6.0 gas to a 3500 diesel. The biggest advantage I see was the diesel has a exhaust brake. Plus the diesel doesn't seem to work very hard at all when pulling. My mileage with the gasser pulling the fiver was 7MPG. My milage now with a larger fiver is roughly 12MPG.

 

[TravisJen]

We have a '12 Ram 3500 6.7L diesel that the wife uses as a daily driver and the only issues we've had is the engine not getting hot enough in the winter. This has led to the truck going into regen every few days which is a pain in the *** but I'll tlake that inconvenience if it means not towing with a gas engine. This thing tows like a dream.

 

[whp4262]

I have a Dodge 1-ton dually with the cummins diesel as a tow vehicle for our Cyclone. The trailer weighs 14,000 empty and 18,000 max gross so its pretty heavy but the truck seems to handle it pretty well. I just made a trip from Hammond, LA to Fort Worth, TX about 3 weeks ago with the cruise set on 60 and it stayed right there with power to spare. I usually run 60-65 mph and average 10 mpg, the steeper hills will drag it down but not as much as it did with my gas trucks. I'm not a big fan of Dodge but I do like the reliability of the cummins engine and my maintenance cost hasn't been that bad. I do all of my own repairs on everything so I don't have labor costs but as far as parts over the last 140,000 miles, truck has 250,000 total, I have replaced the radiator, 1 high pressure fuel pump, 2 lift pumps, 2 idler pulleys, fan belts and the normal oil and batteries. This is my third diesel truck, 2 were chevys, and I wouldn't go back to gas and I also think the dually is the only way to go if you are pulling a heavy trailer. All of my trucks have been used for towing and daily drivers without any problems caused by running them empty. Probably the biggest thing with diesels is clean fuel and running them long enough to get them hot, diesels don't like cold operating temperatures. I use a block heater when the temps get in the 30s, I let it warm up a little before I take off and I keep the rpms down around 1500 until it warms up enough to stop rattling. As a side note the diesel engine is heavier then the gas so it helps to keep some weight on the front end when the back is loaded down but for the same reason they are worthless in the snow or mud without 4 wheel drive.

 

[Bob&Patty]

The difference will be night and day towing. The '08 Fords are a good truck.....and I'm a GM guy. The 08's now have the better trans. How many miles does it have? If you can get a good deal...I would go for it. Ya never know, you might upgrade for a bigger trailer at some point and now will have a truck to pull it. JMHO

 

[brianharrison]

As mentioned the 6.4 PowerStroke is a good engine. I am very happy with mine. However there are some things to watch for specifically for the 6.4L. Here is a Youtube channel that has some good videos from user powerstrokehelp.

Making sure the engine was looked after is probably the key - documented history showing fluids changed per schedule, especially the coolant flush and refill with proper Ford antifreeze additives. The 6.4 has a HUGE water pump (to cool the EGR coolers) and front case can experience cavitation and possible damage if the properly maintained coolant (flush and refill the Ford additives) is not done correctly.

Secondly, depending on the build date (job 1, 2, or 3) there are recalls that should be confirmed they have been completed for specific VINS - check the VIN with the Ford Dealer to make sure all the recalls are done for the specific vehicle you are purchasing.

There are a few other items that I would look at (that I looked after on my truck) - PM or post request here and I will elaborate.

Bottom line, as mentioned the 6.4 will pull a lot better than a gasser, and I have no concerns with being a daily driver.

Brian

 

[wino2]

I have driven Fords with diesels for the last 15 years. There is nothing like the torque of a diesel to help you pull a hill.
The cost may be more to maintain, but at 100k miles a gas engine is getting tired, a diesel is just getting broken in.
If the unit has been well maintained, I would go for the diesel. Just remember to idle a diesel for 5 minutes after a hard pull so that the oil in the turbo doesn't fry. Good luck on what you decide.

 

[dadtoandrew]

Just remember to idle a diesel for 5 minutes after a hard pull so that the oil in the turbo doesn't fry.

Why after a hard pull? I would have thought more important before a pull to make sure the oil is flowing good?

 

[whp4262]

Cooling the turbo down by idling the engine is common with turbocharged aircraft. The turbo gets really hot, sometimes hot enough to glow on a plane. If you shut them down when they are really hot the oil trapped in the turbo can coke the shaft and bearings. So by idling the engine you cool the turbo down enough to not cook the oil. This is not as much of a problem with cars because the turbo usually does not run as hard but it still doesn't hurt to cool the turbo and engine down a little after pulling hard.

 

[HornedToad]

"Getting roughly 12 MPG when towing with current TV, which I don't think is really all that bad, considering the weight I'm tugging around. It really drops the speeds on the hills and works the engine hard to keep going up the hill (will not maintain speed, WAY too many RPMs). On some of the hills I usually end up dropping around 15-20 MPH on the hills."

I am also towing with gas, 2008 Ford F250 V10 pulling a fifth wheel toyhauler around 13,000 lbs loaded, 8 MPH towing, 10 MPH in the city & 13 MPH on the highway unloaded, so 12 MPH towing is not bad at all!!!

I faced the same decision when we upgrade from a travel trailer to a fifth wheel, and decided to stick with gas... #1 It's my daily driver #2 It's paid for.

What I try to do is drive the tachometer instead of the speedometer. Yes you lose a little speed on the steep hills but it keeps the the engine from over working.

 

[westxsrt10]

Do you really want to buy a used truck with 175,000 miles? The 6.4L Ford engine is not without issues.
Consider a 6.8L V-10, 2008-2010, plenty of power and expect 10 mpg towing your rig.

 

[TandT]

No question about it. Get a diesel. More power and torque, better mileage, longer life.

BTW, I average 14mpg towing a 15K lb. trailer and 22mpg running empty. Trace

 

[CHRIS-123]

I had a 5.7 hemi before pulling my trailer and upgraded last February to a 6.7 diesel and like must others have said night and day towing in the hills and flat land

 

[Bob&Patty]

200K miles....no way. This guy is selling for a reason....and it might not be a good reason.

 

[scottyb]

200K miles....no way. This guy is selling for a reason....and it might not be a good reason.

Not necessarily. I have sold or traded 6 diesel pickups over the last 20 years with 185 - 250K. 3 of them were to people who know me and my trucks, and were waiting to pounce when I got ready to sell. They drove them for another 50-100K+ before they were sold, except 1 was totalled in an accident. My last, the Chevy, had 186K and I would bet my paycheck that it will go another 100K with proper care.