Towing with a D/A HD2500

[Skipper5]

Thanks to Bob&Patty and others.

My real confusion relates to the door sticker. 4500 front, 6084 rear. My TV is rated to tow a total of 22,000lbs (including the truck).

The BH I'm looking at ready to camp will be under the 22,000lb. rating, when hooked up. I'm more concerned about pin weight. If I have 2500lbs. pin weight, and my truck weighs 7340, I will be over max truck weight of 9200, but well under the rear axle rating.

Some of the boys over at rv.net are really stuck on this 9200lbs. as per sticker, but can't explain the sticker. Others say that the front and rear rates are certified from the OEM. My manual also states up to a 3000lb. payload is what the truck can haul.

I don't want to spend thousands for a new truck, but can spend hundreds to make my truck a one ton if needed. (wheels, tires, and springs)

Again...Thanks to all for your replies.

Skip

 

[6.7powerstroke]

You can spend 100K and your truck will never be a "legal" 1 ton. The tow rating means nothing, it is just marketing fluff assuming the lightest configuration of the truck available. 2wd, regular cab, gas burner, no options. Notice the "up to" rating. As I posted earlier, the GCWR is not a concern for a 3/4 ton. Your GVWR will be over before you hit that. 9200 sounds like the GVWR for your truck. You CAN NOT legally exceed that rating. In the simplest of terms, the weight on steer axle and drive axle combined can not be over 9200 or you are legally overloaded. I don't know what your truck weighs, but I would figure somewhere in the 7000-7400 range. Add people, hitch, gear, whatever and you are going to exceed what the truck is legally rated for. Is it unsafe? Only you can answer that, but 1 pound over is as illegal as 1000 pounds over. The weight ratings are there for a reason so only you can determine what you think is good enough. Keep in mind, the axle is just one component of the weight rating and it is usually never the weak link. Usually it is tires and wheels. However, these are just components that contribute to the overall rating of 9200 for the truck. I know this is frustrating and confusing, but it is what it is. You are more than likely going to be overloaded with a 2500 pin weight on any 3/4 ton. I hope this helped some.

 

[ihsolutions]

You can spend 100K and your truck will never be a "legal" 1 ton.

On all the forums there is always this talk of "legal" vs. "illegal" when exceeding the GVWR of a vehicle.

Yet, I have never seen one link or reference to any law stating that it is "illegal" to exceed one's GVWR. Maybe someone can find a reference. I can't.

 

[Bob&Patty]

Jeff, you would either talk to a state trooper or get a copy of the DMV drivers book and read it. All I can tell you is what I know in California. If I had the book in front of me I would give you the quote. The police here will write you a ticket if you are over your GCVW for the TV. They don't check your pin weight...they just go by what is listed in the owners manual. Mine is 22K...period. It also my be different here because every pickup truck has commercial plates....by law. I had commercial plates on a 1984 El Camino, so go figure.

As to your statement about "finding a reference to being "legal or "illegal" to be "over" on the GCVW rating. Stop and think for a minute about that statement. Why does every state have "truck Scales" on the interstates. Well, it's to find out a if a truck is over weight,by total gross weight, over weight on 1 or more axles, or over on the bridge law (don't ask). All commercial vehicles have weight limits, by # of axles or combinations of axles and placement. Unless you have ever had a CDL or studied the test, it would very hard to sit here and explain it all. It's not hard to see a pickup that is over loaded. I have seen 1/2 tn's with 2 pallets of bricks in the back...front wheels off the ground. We could sit at our putors all day a fuss at each other about what is and what isn't. The end result will be nothing. The weight listing by the Big 3 are there for a reason. There name is??.........DOT.

Could you or would you ever get stopped for being over weight? Would you ever be stopped to check if you have a CDL on a trailer with a gross weight rating of over 15001#? Probably not and only if your headlight where waking up birds in the tree's or your TV's back bumper was dragging on the ground. The WHOLE point to these conversations is to inform people what is and is not legal. Then let them do what they want.

 

[branson4020]

Here's the Driver's Handbook and here's the Recreational Vehicle Handbook.

 

[6.7powerstroke]

Good post, sums it up. Don't exceed the GVWR of either the truck or the trailer and you will be fine.

 

[ihsolutions]

Jeff, you would either talk to a state trooper or get a copy of the DMV drivers book and read it. All I can tell you is what I know in California. If I had the book in front of me I would give you the quote. The police here will write you a ticket if you are over your GCVW for the TV. They don't check your pin weight...they just go by what is listed in the owners manual. Mine is 22K...period. It also my be different here because every pickup truck has commercial plates....by law. I had commercial plates on a 1984 El Camino, so go figure.

As to your statement about "finding a reference to being "legal or "illegal" to be "over" on the GCVW rating. Stop and think for a minute about that statement. Why does every state have "truck Scales" on the interstates. Well, it's to find out a if a truck is over weight,by total gross weight, over weight on 1 or more axles, or over on the bridge law (don't ask). All commercial vehicles have weight limits, by # of axles or combinations of axles and placement. Unless you have ever had a CDL or studied the test, it would very hard to sit here and explain it all. It's not hard to see a pickup that is over loaded. I have seen 1/2 tn's with 2 pallets of bricks in the back...front wheels off the ground. We could sit at our putors all day a fuss at each other about what is and what isn't. The end result will be nothing. The weight listing by the Big 3 are there for a reason. There name is??.........DOT.

Bob, you are we are not talking about the same thing. I'm talking about the GVWR of the truck, in my case (see sig), it's 9200lbs. I'm not talking about GCVWR (in my case, 22k), and I'm in agreement with everything you've said about that.

 

[Bob&Patty]

Jeff, yes I agree with you that the specs on the trucks are hard to figure out. All I know for sure, that when I axle weighed our rig at a Cat Scale, I was #400 under the gross weight and had a pin weight of about 2700#'s. Like I said, I doubt if anyone will ever get pulled over and ran through the scales. If you drive properly and somewhat within the speed limits you will be fine. The adendums to the class "C" is a mystery to me. It's in the handbook, but go to DMV and they have NO IDEA of what your talking about. I did and walked out the door......."write me a ticket and I will fight you over it". If the state workers don't know what it is ..then how in H*** would I know. But it is in the handbook........SO...I give up. I think I will make a phone call and post back what I find out on the truck weight specs.

As to skips problem....a 3670 is to much coach for a 2500 but thats JMHO.

 

[6.7powerstroke]

DOT has plenty of portable scales, have seen them in action on big rigs all the time. Will they pull over a trailer? I doubt it, but if you are like the moron I saw the other say with a lifted duramax 2500, pulling a 32' 5er with a 19' mastercraft boat behind it, you will get pulled over, just like he did. His headlights were pointing at the moon and he was obviously overloaded and a huge liability to everyone else on the road. Again, the GCWR means nothing if you overload the GVWR of the truck, period. Take a goosneck livestock trailer, they have a much heavier pin weight than a standard RV. You will always exceed the GVWR of the TV before the GCWR is overloaded with a 3/4 ton tow vehicle.

 

[branson4020]

Jeff, yes I agree with you that the specs on the trucks are hard to figure out. All I know for sure, that when I axle weighed our rig at a Cat Scale, I was #400 under the gross weight and had a pin weight of about 2700#'s. Like I said, I doubt if anyone will ever get pulled over and ran through the scales. If you drive properly and somewhat within the speed limits you will be fine. The adendums to the class "C" is a mystery to me. It's in the handbook, but go to DMV and they have NO IDEA of what your talking about. I did and walked out the door......."write me a ticket and I will fight you over it". If the state workers don't know what it is ..then how in H*** would I know. But it is in the handbook........SO...I give up. I think I will make a phone call and post back what I find out on the truck weight specs.

As to skips problem....a 3670 is to much coach for a 2500 but thats JMHO.

Hey Bob,

If you really want to settle this with authority, when you talk to the DMV and they say "such-and-such is the law", make sure they cite the section of the California Vehicle Code that spells it out. And thanks for the discussion. You can never hash this topic over too many times.

 

[Bob&Patty]

Bob, I am going to call the CHP and he General. This "hash" is getting pretty old though. It would be great boon to mankind if we had somewhere on the forum where all the state's law's on towing were spelled out. That way there is no dispute over what it is. Then any Oldie or Newbie can read for themselves.

 

[branson4020]

Bob, I am going to call the CHP and The general. This "hash" is getting pretty old though. It would be great boon to man
kind if we had somewhere on the forum all the state's law's on towing spelled out. That way there is no dispute over what it is. Then any Oldie or Newbie can read for themselves.

Well, I hope you have better luck than I had trying to get some towing answers here in Oregon. Called the DMV and they said "gosh, you'll have to call the State Police." Called the State Police and they said "for towing and weight regulations you need to talk to ODOT." I said "it's not a commercial vehicle." They said "well, then check with DMV." I just said "thank you." I was afraid to say anything else 'cause I think they have caller id.

 

[danemayer]

How do they tell the Gross Combination Weight Rating if there's no label?

(j) "Gross combination weight rating" means the value specified by the manufacturer as the maximum loaded weight of a combination or articulated vehicle. In the absence of a value specified by the manufacturer, gross vehicle weight rating will be determined by adding the gross vehicle weight rating of the power unit and the total weight of the towed units and any load thereon.

Taken from CA DMV Publications website

 

[branson4020]

How do they tell the Gross Combination Weight Rating if there's no label?



Taken from CA DMV Publications website

Now, what the heck does that mean? Sounds like the GCWR becomes whatever I happen to be at the moment I'm stopped? I still don't get it. I'm not surprised that even CHP guys get confused.

 

[Bob&Patty]

Bob....YEP. My point exactly. Sounds to me like all the County Mounties have "NOT A CLUE". So I think I will go order the biggest LM I can and hook it to a 1/2 tn with a V6 and 5 speed. WOOOOOOPIE..........now that would be a"banzi" run. Better yet, how about a VW beatle with a hole drilled in roof. YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEHAAAAA