What Options Would You Want on a Ram 3500?

[AFMagnum]

Ok, it's time to pull the trigger on a TV. We have a 2018 Big Country 4010RD 5th wheel we bought in March and we're currently full timing in it. I had someone move it from the dealership to where it currently sits in an RV park. We aren't going anywhere until next summer so getting a TV wasn't something we needed to buy right away. Now, with the 2018 1-ton trucks showing up on dealer lots, I figure it's a good time to try and grab a deal on a new 2017 Ram 3500. I picked the Ram for many different reasons, but I don't want this to turn into another "which truck is best" thread. Since this will be my first Ram truck, and my first TV, I'm more interested to know what options everyone would want given the chance to buy a new truck.

So, here's what I've come up with:

My Big Country 5th Wheel Specs:
42.5' Long
GVWR: 16,000lbs
Scale Weights (full): Gross - 15,860lbs; Tong - 4,340lbs

Ram 3500 Options:
Must Haves:
-Crew or Mega Cab
-8' Bed
-6.7-Liter Cummings Diesel
-Aisin 6-Speed Trans
-4.10 Axle Ratio
-Dual Rear Wheels
-Auto Level Rear Air Suspension
-Trailer Brake Control
-5th Wheel Prep Package

Nice to Have:
-Spray-In Bedliner
-Tubular Side Steps
-Auxiliary Switches
-ParkView Rear Backup Camera
-ParkView Cargo Area Camera

The rest of the options all add comfort or luxury but don't really help with actually pulling the RV. So what am I missing? Comments/Suggestions/Concerns?

 

[SLO]

All of the above plus Longhorn package


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[SNOKING]

Aux switches move things on the lower row to the 8.4 display. If you really think you will use them then get them. People that are not using them wish they had the hard switches that are normally on the lower row.

With 16K GVWR for trailer you do not need the 4:10 gears. 5th gear with 3.42's turn the same 1750 RPMs that 4.10s do in 6th at 60 MPH. The lower first and second in the Aisin gets a load moving with 3.42s.

Now get this 80 MPH with 3.42s to is a nice quiet 1750 RPMs in 6th gear. So if you are not going to move to a heavier trailer and bobtail a lot think about 3.42s. Either way 3.73s are just wrong!

3.42s with a dually CC 4x4 LB are rated to 20,520 lbs Max Trailer Weight owing. Being in Texas is a second reason for the tall gears. Running 2330 RPM in 6th with 4.10s for hours across Texas at 80 MPH would not be fun.

4.10s at rated to 30,320 or almost twice the load you are going to be towing.

Chris

 

[kf5qby]

If you are looking for a 4x4 you may want to consider Amp retractable side steps instead of the tubular steps. My wife had a real problem getting in to my truck with the Mopar rails. They hug the body and make for a climb for a shorter person.

The Amp steps extend from under the truck when you open the door and make it much easier to get in.

 

[AFMagnum]

Aux switches move things on the lower row to the 8.4 display. If you really think you will use them then get them. People that are not using them wish they had the hard switches that are normally on the lower row.

With 16K GVWR for trailer you do not need the 4:10 gears. 5th gear with 3.42's turn the same 1750 RPMs that 4.10s do in 6th at 60 MPH. The lower first and second in the Aisin gets a load moving with 3.42s.

Now get this 80 MPH with 3.42s to is a nice quiet 1750 RPMs in 6th gear. So if you are not going to move to a heavier trailer and bobtail a lot think about 3.42s. Either way 3.73s are just wrong!

3.42s with a dually CC 4x4 LB are rated to 20,520 lbs Max Trailer Weight owing. Being in Texas is a second reason for the tall gears. Running 2330 RPM in 6th with 4.10s for hours across Texas at 80 MPH would not be fun.

4.10s at rated to 30,320 or almost twice the load you are going to be towing.

Chris

Chris,

This is an awesome explanation, thank you! My rational behind the 4.10 was so I could be flexible if I wanted to get something heavier down the road like the DVR Mobile Suites. I didn't consider running at 2330RPMs vs 1750RPMs at 80mph. I'll have to reconsider this.

-Jeff

 

[AFMagnum]

If you are looking for a 4x4 you may want to consider Amp retractable side steps instead of the tubular steps. My wife had a real problem getting in to my truck with the Mopar rails. They hug the body and make for a climb for a shorter person.

The Amp steps extend from under the truck when you open the door and make it much easier to get in.

Hmm, good point. My wife has a hard time getting into my Jeep right now so she'll most likely have the same issue getting into the Ram with the side steps. I'll have to take a look at the Amp steps, thanks.

-Jeff

 

[farside291]

I agree with the steps for sure, I carry a small step stool for my DW to get in and out of the truck. Have left it behind twice. I have the LongHorn package and its nice for sure. I have the 4.10 gears and do not notice the noise, though I seldom drive 80 mph. Pulling my 3950FB which is just under 42 feet and fully loaded on a level road I net around 11 mpg, hilly roads around 10 mpg. Empty at 65 mph I net around 19 mph. That's hand calculated, DIC says just over 20 mpg. Move up to 70 - 75 and mileage drops considerably. Oh, the 4.10s get you a fancy finned differential cover. I wish I had the airbags but none of the trucks had them on the lot and to get the big discount I took one from the lot. I heard the ride is different on a truck with factory airbags. The rear springs are supposedly softer than a truck with out air bags. All of the trucks on the lot had bed liners and the LED lighting package. What ever you decide you will love the truck, I know I do.

 

[danemayer]

For sure you'll want side rails to help you get in and out of the truck. And you may want to reconsider the bed liner. The bed surface is very slippery with even a little moisture.

You didn't mention 4x4. You definitely want that. Even if you don't expect to ever drive in snow, you'll have occasion to be on soft or muddy ground where 4 wheel drive will be essential.

We have the Aisin transmission with the 3.73 rear axle. Maybe a good middle ground between 3.42 and 4.10. Plenty of power to tow 16,000 lbs and more.

 

[farside291]

One more thing to add, the park view assist is a must. I can't count the number of times it has save me from hitting something while backing. I don't hesitate to pull forward into parking spots anymore with the front and rear park sensors. But, remember this, if you are backing to hook the fifth wheel and the tailgate is down the park sensors do not take that into consideration. I came real close to putting my tail gate into the generator compartment.
The cargo camera is cool, but I don't think I have ever used it to hitch up.

 

[Bones]

Ok, it's time to pull the trigger on a TV. We have a 2018 Big Country 4010RD 5th wheel we bought in March and we're currently full timing in it. I had someone move it from the dealership to where it currently sits in an RV park. We aren't going anywhere until next summer so getting a TV wasn't something we needed to buy right away. Now, with the 2018 1-ton trucks showing up on dealer lots, I figure it's a good time to try and grab a deal on a new 2017 Ram 3500. I picked the Ram for many different reasons, but I don't want this to turn into another "which truck is best" thread. Since this will be my first Ram truck, and my first TV, I'm more interested to know what options everyone would want given the chance to buy a new truck.

So, here's what I've come up with:

My Big Country 5th Wheel Specs:
42.5' Long
GVWR: 16,000lbs
Scale Weights (full): Gross - 15,860lbs; Tong - 4,340lbs

Ram 3500 Options:
Must Haves:
-Crew or Mega Cab
-8' Bed
-6.7-Liter Cummings Diesel
-Aisin 6-Speed Trans
-4.10 Axle Ratio
-Dual Rear Wheels
-Auto Level Rear Air Suspension
-Trailer Brake Control
-5th Wheel Prep Package

Nice to Have:
-Spray-In Bedliner
-Tubular Side Steps
-Auxiliary Switches
-ParkView Rear Backup Camera
-ParkView Cargo Area Camera

The rest of the options all add comfort or luxury but don't really help with actually pulling the RV. So what am I missing? Comments/Suggestions/Concerns?

I had the 3.73 in my prior truck. I have 4.10 in my current truck and I wouldn't do with out it. It is a nice start for pulling your rig. As for fuel mileage 13 to 14 normal driving for me 9-11 towing. I think the bed liner is a must as well. I have the aux switches and use one for my dash cam. I would have liked to have been able to get the rear view camera and the cargo camera. I have a small camera set up so I can see the hitch when hooking up the truck and camper. I do OK with the factory supplied side steps. 4x4 would be a must for me as well. I have used it a couple times when backing the rig up on an incline on gravel the back wheels just started to spin and not move the rig up.

 

[SNOKING]

Chris,

This is an awesome explanation, thank you! My rational behind the 4.10 was so I could be flexible if I wanted to get something heavier down the road like the DVR Mobile Suites. I didn't consider running at 2330RPMs vs 1750RPMs at 80mph. I'll have to reconsider this.

-Jeff

People seem to think that you have for always tow in the highest gear, when what you really want to work on is finding a ratio that puts the engine in a good RPM while towing. With the new trucks 1750 is about the best RPM to shoot for.


4.10s in 6th at 1750 RPM puts you at about 60 MPH (at 66 MPH 4.10s are at 1922 RPMs) (at 72 MPH 4.10s are at 2100 RPMs)
3.73s in 6th at 1750 RPM puts you at about 66 MPH.
3.42s in 6th at 1750 RPM puts you at about 72 MPH.

I use this tool https://www.ringpinion.com/calculators/Calc_RPM.aspx

You have to find the static loaded radius for the tires and double it. For the duallies I use 29.8" which matches up to what actual users on the TDR site report on speed/RPMs.

AISIN AS69RC TRANSMISSION RATIOS & QUICK SPECS

Gear	1st	2nd	3rd	4th	5th	6th	Rev
Ratio	3.75 : 1	2.00 : 1	1.34 : 1	1.00 : 1	0.77 : 1	0.63 : 1	3.54 : 1

CHRYSLER 68RFE TRANSMISSION RATIOS & QUICK SPECS

Gear	1st	2nd	3rd	4th	5th	6th	Rev
Ratio	3.23 : 1	1.84 : 1	1.41 : 1	1.00 : 1	0.82 : 1	0.63 : 1	4.44 : 1

With six speeds forward you can use more gears for day to day use. Another note is that in tow haul mode with 3.42 gears the truck shifts from 4th to 5th at 55 MPH and into 6th at 65 MPH. These shift points can be manually extended to higher RPMs with the max gear select button on the shifter.

The .63 6 th gear is a pretty steep over drive ratio. Looking at first and second gear in the Aisin vs the 68RFE you can see why the Aisin works well with the tall gear gear ratio. The only place the 68RFE wins in in reverse. If one backs up hills alot with a load the BD 2 low plug and play kit for 149 bucks solves that issue.

When we purchased our 2015 3500 4x4 SRW with 3.42s, if 3.73s would have been available I would have got them. After two years and 33K miles I realize that would have been a mistake. We tow our BH3575el fully loaded to 16K and with a 24500 combined weight. We tow in the West with lots of mountains, when we go to 4th gear (1.00:1) we can maintain 60 MPH(the speed we tow at) on a climb and still be around 2250 RPMs.

These new RAMs make full rated torque at 1700 RPM.

We use our truck for our main go to vehicle a lot and love the nice low rpm quiet freeway cruising.

Your DRV thing is the only issue I see that you need to think about. Our friends with DRVs are having their share of issues, so you might want to look into that before jumping in the deep end of the pool. You might want to check out New Horizon and a Volvo TV.

Chris

 

[NYSUPstater]

May I add too that with a 4x4 you can put in 4 low while backing up and pushing the 5er uphill. Makes for less strain on eng and tranny. Our driveway is as such and never used 4 low until this coach for it's a lot heavier. Have a lot more torque for pushing the 5er.

 

[szewczyk_john]

I have a 2017 Ram bought in February. I have the 4x4 crew cab Aisin 4.10 gears. Mine is the Laramie edition so I got most of the options added in under that package. I will never again own a truck without the 4.10 gearing. You are right to think about future trailers and the need to be able to pull other trailers than what you have now. If my new truck is noisy, I don't notice it as it seems quieter than my old 06 was. the old truck got better gas milage but the power of this tranny and 4.10 gearing is amazing.

I suggest the sprayed on bed liner and the rear view camera. I have the cargo camera and rear view camera's. I use the rear view all the time and it comes in handy as long as the truck is.

If you are set on the long bed you can not get the Mega Cab, they do not make that combo. I went from a mega cab to the crew cab, the mega cab has a done of interior storage that I do miss as there is very little of that in the new crew cab, but I wanted the long bed.

I also like the tri-fold tonneau cover that keeps the bed dry and items out of sight. I know that any knife will cut it open so it is not a real secure place but just out of sight is usually enough. With the tri-fold folded up, the cargo camera does little to help hooking up the fifth wheel. With out the the tri-fold it can be useful but I prefer to have my bed covered after I get to my destination so I use the cargo camera very little.

I have the aux switches and have hooked up 3 items so far. It is amazing how simple it is to connect them and then set them as constant or momentary. They are worth the extra few bucks.

The rear air suspension is great in my opinion. It is not user adjustable and some might not like that. Your truck will always ride at the same height regardless of load unless you go over payload. There is a setting for trailer height which lowers the rear so that it rides level but that can only be achieved with a load in the bed.

If you work on your own trucks, I strongly suggest a subscription to the "Turbo Diesel Register" which is a Cummins/Ram specific owner's group. The provide a lot of information that I have found helpful over the years. You also should know about Geno's Garage which is a supplier of OEM and aftermarket goods made for the Ram owners. If you sign up to the TDR you will get access to a forum site similar to this, a quarterly magazine, and a Geno's catalog. I am nothing more than a paid subscriber and I have nothing to do with either company, I am just a big fan of both.

 

[AFMagnum]

What ever you decide you will love the truck, I know I do.

Exactly!

...you may want to reconsider the bed liner.

Only reason I didn't include the bed liner as a "must have" was because I know I can easily add it after the purchase. And good point on the 4x4.

One more thing to add, the park view assist is a must.

This was the same as the bed liner, only reason it wasn't a "must have" was because I know I can add it after the fact. I'm trying to keep my "requirements" as wide as possible to increase my chances of finding a good deal.

I had the 3.73 in my prior truck. I have 4.10 in my current truck and I wouldn't do with out it.

That's interesting, even with the AISIN transmission you saw a big difference with take-off from 3.73 versus 4.10? How much does your Gateway weigh? What was the difference in mileage between 3.73 and 4.10?

...you can put in 4 low while backing up and pushing the 5er uphill. Have a lot more torque for pushing the 5er.

Another great point I did not consider.

With the new trucks 1750 is about the best RPM to shoot for.

Holy crap Chris, thank you for taking the time to write all this. I have a lot to learn about gear ratios. What is the "status load radius" you referenced? I'm completely unfamiliar with that. How do I know when to manually extend the shift points? Is that just based on personal preference? What's the tong weight of your BH3575el? I'm surprised you have SRW for a 16K rig. This truck will also be my daily driver...

 

[AFMagnum]

I have the aux switches and have hooked up 3 items so far. It is amazing how simple it is to connect them and then set them as constant or momentary. They are worth the extra few bucks.

The rear air suspension is great in my opinion. It is not user adjustable and some might not like that. Your truck will always ride at the same height regardless of load unless you go over payload. There is a setting for trailer height which lowers the rear so that it rides level but that can only be achieved with a load in the bed.

If you work on your own trucks, I strongly suggest a subscription to the "Turbo Diesel Register" which is a Cummins/Ram specific owner's group. The provide a lot of information that I have found helpful over the years. You also should know about Geno's Garage which is a supplier of OEM and aftermarket goods made for the Ram owners. If you sign up to the TDR you will get access to a forum site similar to this, a quarterly magazine, and a Geno's catalog. I am nothing more than a paid subscriber and I have nothing to do with either company, I am just a big fan of both.

Thanks for all the feedback; there was a lot of information here that I really appreciate. I definitely play with add-ons a lot so it's good to hear the aux switches work as advertised. And I haven't heard much about the air suspense option so thanks for that. And thanks for the tip on the TDR; I will definitely sign up for that.

 

[SNOKING]

I will never again own a truck without the 4.10 gearing. You are right to think about future trailers and the need to be able to pull other trailers than what you have now. If my new truck is noisy, I don't notice it as it seems quieter than my old 06 was. the old truck got better gas milage but the power of this tranny and 4.10 gearing is amazing.

Comparing gearing between the 3rd gens and the new 2013+ is like comparing moldy strawberries to a fresh apple.

You can get to the alt ride height to stay on without a load. The trick is it has to be turned on while the bed has a load (500+ lbs). This feature stays active unless you turn it off (this is according to Cummins12V98 on TDR).

2X joining TDR, I have been a member since 2001. Chris

 

[Bones]

Exactly!



Only reason I didn't include the bed liner as a "must have" was because I know I can easily add it after the purchase. And good point on the 4x4.



This was the same as the bed liner, only reason it wasn't a "must have" was because I know I can add it after the fact. I'm trying to keep my "requirements" as wide as possible to increase my chances of finding a good deal.



That's interesting, even with the AISIN transmission you saw a big difference with take-off from 3.73 versus 4.10? How much does your Gateway weigh? What was the difference in mileage between 3.73 and 4.10?



Another great point I did not consider.



Holy crap Chris, thank you for taking the time to write all this. I have a lot to learn about gear ratios. What is the "status load radius" you referenced? I'm completely unfamiliar with that. How do I know when to manually extend the shift points? Is that just based on personal preference? What's the tong weight of your BH3575el? I'm surprised you have SRW for a 16K rig. This truck will also be my daily driver...

I have had the experience to be able to have pulled my rig of 15.5k with two different trucks. The one with 3.73 would pull fine but worked hard to get the rig up to speed. My new rig works hard but I can tell that it does not care as much. It does not lug the engine as I like to call it.

I see a couple post about torque at a certain RPM, is that while just cruising down the road or is that trying to keep the torque right at 1700 RPM going up a hill.

- - - Updated - - -

Comparing gearing between the 3rd gens and the new 2013+ is like comparing moldy strawberries to a fresh apple.

You can get to the alt ride height to stay on without a load. The trick is it has to be turned on while the bed has a load (500+ lbs). This feature stays active unless you turn it off (this is according to Cummins12V98 on TDR).

2X joining TDR, I have been a member since 2001. Chris

I have kept my truck after towing at ALT ride for a week or so after towing. Sometimes I'll keep it there after I've brought the rig home from storage.

 

[SNOKING]

Holy crap Chris, thank you for taking the time to write all this. I have a lot to learn about gear ratios. What is the "status load radius" you referenced? I'm completely unfamiliar with that. How do I know when to manually extend the shift points? Is that just based on personal preference? What's the tong weight of your BH3575el? I'm surprised you have SRW for a 16K rig. This truck will also be my daily driver...

Static loaded radius of a tire is the radius of the tire with a load on it. The squish on the tire foot print extends into the diameter of the tire. So to use the gear calculator the publish diameter does not work. So you need the static loaded radius x 2.

Manually controlling gears is both a personal choice issue and helpful of certain conditions.

One of the reasons we picked the Bighorn 3575el was it has a low 2435 dry pin weight. We run heavy as semi homeless retirees. Lots of tools, golf clubs, 6 gals of diesel, 270 lbs of Demco picture frame and B&W manual slider hitch, etc. We are under the 7K RGAWR and over the TV 11700 GVWR by 50 lbs the last time we weighed. However the truck is registered to 12K in Washington State. So I have a few lbs to spare.

DW did not want a duallie, and I was not set on training wheels. We towed in Nevada last fall going to Az in 40+ MPH cross winds and did NOT get pushed around.

Chris

- - - Updated - - -

I have had the experience to be able to have pulled my rig of 15.5k with two different trucks. The one with 3.73 would pull fine but worked hard to get the rig up to speed. My new rig works hard but I can tell that it does not care as much. It does not lug the engine as I like to call it.

I see a couple post about torque at a certain RPM, is that while just cruising down the road or is that trying to keep the torque right at 1700 RPM going up a hill.

- - - Updated - - -



I have kept my truck after towing at ALT ride for a week or so after towing. Sometimes I'll keep it there after I've brought the rig home from storage.

In reality with all the torque management in these new trucks I think one seldom sees max torque.

What year was the truck with 3.73s and did it have the Aisin? Chris

 

[Bones]

Static loaded radius of a tire is the radius of the tire with a load on it. The squish on the tire foot print extends into the diameter of the tire. So to use the gear calculator the publish diameter does not work. So you need the static loaded radius x 2.

Manually controlling gears is both a personal choice issue and helpful of certain conditions.

One of the reasons we picked the Bighorn 3575el was it has a low 2435 dry pin weight. We run heavy as semi homeless retirees. Lots of tools, golf clubs, 6 gals of diesel, 270 lbs of Demco picture frame and B&W manual slider hitch, etc. We are under the 7K RGAWR and over the TV 11700 GVWR by 50 lbs the last time we weighed. However the truck is registered to 12K in Washington State. So I have a few lbs to spare.

DW did not want a duallie, and I was not set on training wheels. We towed in Nevada last fall going to Az in 40+ MPH cross winds and did NOT get pushed around.

Chris

- - - Updated - - -



In reality with all the torque management in these new trucks I thing one seldom see max torque.

What year was the truck with 3.73s and did it have the Aisin? Chris

I actually hate my torque management. It is really my one big gripe.

The truck very within one year of another so they had very similar engines however the new truck has the HO engine. The first truck was a 2014 and the second truck was a 2015.

Oh I forgot to add the 2014 was the 68RFE and the 2015 is the AISIN

 

[SNOKING]

Oh I forgot to add the 2014 was the 68RFE and the 2015 is the AISIN

Apples and Oranges. Non HO vs HO and different tranny ratios as I noted above.

Torque gets a load moving and HP wins races. RAM would do better in the hill climb test if they were paddle shifted and allowed to turn up more RPMs. Mac HP is at 2800 RPMs. I do not think I have ever turned up to the RPM towing, but again I am not trying to win a race.

Chris