Looking for Tire Changing method recommendations

[ksucats]

Well, took the coach to the local welding and trailer repair shop this morning. We lifted the coach (each side) using the levelup. They had to use a six foot extension on two of the lugs because their impact wrench would not budge them; a four foot extension just wanted to bend. When they got the two off it looked like the rim itself had been scalded (I think that is the right word) by the over torque. Replaced the studs and then ended up having to get 3/4 inch lugnuts for the 9/16 studs (they did not have any of the 7/8 chrome lug-nuts so I went with the smaller ones - hope I didn't make a mistake. Regardless, at least now I can check the torque on all four wheels, and if need be, remove a tire. BTW - of the 16 lug-nuts we removed, only four were not distorted so I had them replace all on the two wheels involved.

All that said, at 200 hundred pounds I don't think I weighed enough to get the two lugs loosened - the young man who worked on the coach was taxed to get them off as it was and he looked like a football line man!!

Oh, one other thing that struck us all as odd - the lug-nuts only seem to catch a half-inch of the threads before contacting the rims. Trailer is pure stock, rims from the factory with disc brakes. Expected more of the stud to be threaded into the lug-nuts.

 

[JamesL73]

Just wanted to throw this in here. Using the level up works fine. As do the Jack Blocks since they’re rated for 6K each. The one thing to mention if lifting both axels is to make sure the spring hangers are all back in the correct upward position. It took me a while to get those back right with the MorRyde CRE3000. I trashed the Trail Kings and put on Goodyear G614s.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[porthole]

Good? Bad? I'm not a materials engineer. But I note that Heartland, Dexter, and Lippert all say in their documentation that you should lift by the frame.

So your'e not going with the legal department boiler plate anymore?

Lippert avoids all tire changing instructions by just saying - don't do it, hire a pro.


This line is the same in three different Lippert manuals and 4 different jack combos

"Lippert Components Inc. recommends that a trained professional be employed to change the tire on the unit"

I would bet that if you asked all three how to change a tire you will get conflicting answers, with "never" being part of those answers.

Good? Bad? I'm not a materials engineer. But I note that Heartland, Dexter, and Lippert all say in their documentation that you should lift by the frame.

Putting the bottle jack directly against the frame versus perhaps putting something in between to spread the load - might be a good idea.

And yes, you do have to lift the frame a lot higher than you would have to lift by jacking the axle or suspension. But there's no doubt a good reason the manufacturers tell us to lift by the frame.

The suggestions in this thread with lifting the trailer by the frame, high enough to change a tire with a single bottle jack somewhere on the frame, are dubious at best and most likely dangerous or damaging to the trailer frame.


Ever watch MOR/ryde lift a 5th wheel?

Four 60 ton bottle jacks, air over hydraulic, tied to together to lift equally. And those jacks are tall enough to not need blocking to make the required height

- - - Updated - - -



For those that may use some type of drive on prop to get some lift.

The Blaylock EZ-Jack is rated for 20,000 pounds and is what the USCG uses on their small boat trailers, e.g. the 25' Safe boat, Bout 12,000 pounds total on a 3 axle trailer.






I haven't tried it with the Cyclone, but I'll give it a try when I put the hitch back in. I have tried lesser variations, and the trailer crushed them.

You do have to be careful with drive ons like the EZ-Jack. Go to far and you will be in for a long day with some cussing.

 

[danemayer]

So your'e not going with the legal department boiler plate anymore?

Lippert avoids all tire changing instructions by just saying - don't do it, hire a pro.

This line is the same in three different Lippert manuals and 4 different jack combos

"Lippert Components Inc. recommends that a trained professional be employed to change the tire on the unit"

I would bet that if you asked all three how to change a tire you will get conflicting answers, with "never" being part of those answers.

The suggestions in this thread with lifting the trailer by the frame, high enough to change a tire with a single bottle jack somewhere on the frame, are dubious at best and most likely dangerous or damaging to the trailer frame.

Duane,

This is what I'm saying.....

Lippert still has Lip Sheet 0134 on their website, which says:

...To prevent damage to the coach, carry wood blocks to place between the jack and the main rail (I-beam) of the coach and to go under the jack.DO NOT jack the coach on the axle tube or black pipe gas lines that can sometimes be mounted to the
bottom of the I-beam.

Lippert TI-083 Recommendations for Jacking the Frame to Change a Tire, says the same.
Lipperts Axle Hub Replacement Manuals says:

Always lift the trailer by its frame and never by its axle or suspension. Axle and suspension components are not designed, or rated, for the dead weight, point-of-contact loads that the trailer's frame is.

Dexter Q&A says:

Dexter recommends that you do not jack up the trailer on the suspension components because there is always the potential for damage. Bent hangers, leaf springs, or axle tubes can cause bad axle alignment with bad tire wear resulting. Also, many trailer builders do not use Dexter hangers and we have no idea how strong these hangers may or may not be. Therefore, we take the conservative approach and recommend jacking up only on the trailer frame.

Dexter 600-8K Complete Service Manual and others say:

Do not lift or support the trailer on any part of the axle or suspension system.

Heartland Trailer Manual says:

Position a hydraulic jack on the frame close to the spring hanger.

 

[porthole]

Duane,

This is what I'm saying.....

Lippert still has Lip Sheet 0134 on their website, which says:
Lippert TI-083 Recommendations for Jacking the Frame to Change a Tire, says the same.
Lipperts Axle Hub Replacement Manuals says:

Dexter Q&A says:

Dexter 600-8K Complete Service Manual and others say:

And not one of those blurbs say what is the proper way to jack the trailer by the frame. Not one gives a procedure which is both safe and practical.
And most use the disclaimer that you may damage equipment.

Heartland Trailer Manual says:

Position a hydraulic jack on the frame close to the spring hanger.

I actually have a Cyclone manual. A nice, spiral bound 50 page book with everything Cyclone in it. And it has the above line in it, and that's all.

On our previous travel trailer, my motorcycle trailer and multiple boat trailers I was always able to use some sort of drive on prop like the EZ-jack I referenced above. My motorcycle only takes a 3 pieces of 2x6 to get tire clearance.

Before our first long trip with the Cyclone, I tried a tire removal in my driveway, this is before LevelUp. Since I have a bit of expeierence lifting stuff like this I went ahead with the bottle jack on the frame routine.

Before I could get enough clearance to spin the tire I could see the gap around the door shrink at the bottom and expand at the top. That only means one thing is happening, the frame is bending. Some give is to be expected and needed, but what I saw on our trailer was too much for me to continue and risk permanent damage.



Of course, I'm sure not many of us worry about frame bending right?

Of wait, that may not be true. Just in our own club I personally know probably 10 members who have had bent frames - and that is the part of the frame that is supposed ot be able to support the trailer.

 

[brianlajoie]

Once you figure out how to lift the rig... I wanted to throw in my two cents.

I used my level up system to lift and level the trailer and then added 4 jacks (capable of fully supporting the trailer) to help support the trailer when I had to remove all four wheels at once.

I hand rounded a lug nut while taking it off and needed a tire shop to sledge hammer on a special socket with teeth to remove it. The tin covered lug nuts are susceptible to rounding if too much torque it applied. I would not recommend using an air impact wrench either unless the proper torque can be verified. I also suspect that the studs are capable of snapping from too much torque, talking to fellow campers (I have no first hand experience with this though). I bought solid lug nuts and gave away the old ones for fellow camper to have as spares.

 

[porthole]

I’ve used an impact to take my wheels off and a torque wrench when pitting them back on, multiple times.
Last year when pulling the wheels for a brake pad change, one of the studs spun in the rotor hub.

That was a royal pain.