Tire and axle failure in 2011 BRS28 - HELP!!!!!!!!!

[RanCarr]

I'm not sure what we can or should do. I ready read that the 28BRS NorthTrail had inadequate axles for the weight of the trailer. Well now we found out. After no more than 3000 miles both axles are bent and all four tires are BALD on the inner edge... all threads are GONE. The tires are no longer perpendicular to the ground. Now what? This TT had never been in an accident. We've never even hit a pothole. It carries a light load as we're both retired and don't travel with kids and loads of junk. We have anti-sway bars and a WDH. Who do I call at Heartland about this already known weakness in the NT BRS28? We are understandably very upset about this.

And now this, while looking for the information on inadequate axles on the BRS28: http://www.rvbusiness.com/tag/national-highway-traffic-safety-administration/

Heartland Recreational Vehicles LLC is recalling certain model year 2010-2011 North Trail travel trailers. The suspension can come in contact with the LP pipe mounted on the frame under the trailer above the equalizer arm. Which model? Mine? I not only have to fear the ruined tires blowing and having the bent axles break, but now we have to worry about the propane lines also?

 

[danemayer]

Re: Tire and axel failure in 2011 BRS28 - HELP!!!!!!!!!

Hi RanCarr,

Call Heartland Customer Service at 877-262-8032. Have your VIN # ready.

It could be that the axles are defective, rather than inadequate for the weight. I say that because there haven't been a flood of similar complaints from other NorthTrail owners. If the axles were inadequate, I would expect the failure rate to approach 100%.

In my opinion, it's not helpful to call any manufacturer and assert that their design is faulty, inadequate, or wrong. You won't find many manufacturers who would ever agree with you on such an assertion, so right away it becomes more difficult for the manufacturer to come into agreement with you. And of course ultimately you want them to agree that they should help you, even if you're out of warranty.

Heartland may point you to Lippert or Dexter since they warrant the axles. I recall at least one similar report last year where Lippert replaced axles and tires.

 

[TravelTiger]

Re: Tire and axel failure in 2011 BRS28 - HELP!!!!!!!!!

Rann,

If you are the original owner of your trailer and have not moved your mailing address, you would have received a recall notice if your VIN was affected. I'm sure you can call and ask Heartland to calm your fears.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Manzan]

Re: Tire and axel failure in 2011 BRS28 - HELP!!!!!!!!!

I had bad axles on my 2011 21FBS and Lippert replaced them via my dealer. Also gave me $65 per tire when I replaced all five. Dealer was great and after being supplied with pictures, so was Lippert. Simply pointed out to my dealer that there was an obvious problem with only 5K on the trailer. They agreed and all went well. Sort of slow, replaced on axle, put it on and decided that the other axle needed replacing also so they did. Not a weight problem at all, I had weight the rig and was below GVWR by 400#.

 

[RanCarr]

Re: Tire and axel failure in 2011 BRS28 - HELP!!!!!!!!!

Hi RanCarr,

Call Heartland Customer Service at 877-262-8032. Have your VIN # ready.

Thank you. We will call that number with VIN # in hand.

It could be that the axles are defective, rather than inadequate for the weight. I say that because there haven't been a flood of similar complaints from other NorthTrail owners. If the axles were inadequate, I would expect the failure rate to approach 100%.

When I read of this problem 2 years ago I thought it was just someone complaining, a disgruntled buyer and there are just some people who complain about the smallest things. The axles used on the 28' BRS are, I read, the same axles used on a smaller, lighter NT where they were adequate. The BRS28 doesn't have the payload other 28' TTs have. I looked and cannot find that post/discussion on axels. I thought I saw it on RV.net. But I've checked many forums over the years. I never dreamed it would happen to us.

In my opinion, it's not helpful to call any manufacturer and assert that their design is faulty, inadequate, or wrong. You won't find many manufacturers who would ever agree with you on such an assertion, so right away it becomes more difficult for the manufacturer to come into agreement with you. And of course ultimately you want them to agree that they should help you, even if you're out of warranty.

It is quite possible both axles on some of the NTs are defective. That kind of thing happens. Inadequate or defective, I know it happened before because of that thread I ignored back then.

Heartland may point you to Lippert or Dexter since they warrant the axles. I recall at least one similar report last year where Lippert replaced axles and tires.

Do they have dealers all over the place? Our nearest city is Nashville TN. We feel this situation with our BRS28 is too dangerous to haul it far. We crept home with our hearts in our throats yesterday. :*( Both of us sick to our stomachs, upset and depressed.

 

[RanCarr]

Re: Tire and axel failure in 2011 BRS28 - HELP!!!!!!!!!

Rann,

If you are the original owner of your trailer and have not moved your mailing address, you would have received a recall notice if your VIN was affected. I'm sure you can call and ask Heartland to calm your fears.

Yes, we are the original owners and have not moved. My main fear is the TT being unusable (untowable) because of the dangerous condition of the tires and the bent axles. I will ask about the gaslines also.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk[/QUOTE]

 

[RanCarr]

Re: Tire and axel failure in 2011 BRS28 - HELP!!!!!!!!!

I had bad axles on my 2011 21FBS and Lippert replaced them via my dealer. Also gave me $65 per tire when I replaced all five. Dealer was great and after being supplied with pictures, so was Lippert. Simply pointed out to my dealer that there was an obvious problem with only 5K on the trailer. They agreed and all went well. Sort of slow, replaced on axle, put it on and decided that the other axle needed replacing also so they did. Not a weight problem at all, I had weight the rig and was below GVWR by 400#.

We don't know the name of the Axles. We don't know who made them. I suppose HL Customer Service would know. Also, where would we take the BRS to have them and the tires replaced? We're totally heartsick over this. We're thanking God we got home safe yesterday.

BTW, the reason I seldom post here is the constant "server is too busy" errors I get. It get this error with almost every post. I finally give up and move on....

 

[DougS]

Re: Tire and axel failure in 2011 BRS28 - HELP!!!!!!!!!

RanCarr,
your axle should have a tag on it. I would not be surprised if it is a Lippert product. If it is Lippert, you probably have to call them direct at 866-524-7821, they have been answering the phone with only a few rings. While you are looking at the axle tags, you might want to take a picture of it. You need purchase date and last 8 numbers of vin. I have gone through several of their axles.

 

[RanCarr]

Re: Tire and axel failure in 2011 BRS28 - HELP!!!!!!!!!

RanCarr,
your axle should have a tag on it. I would not be surprised if it is a Lippert product. If it is Lippert, you probably have to call them direct at 866-524-7821, they have been answering the phone with only a few rings. While you are looking at the axle tags, you might want to take a picture of it. You need purchase date and last 8 numbers of vin. I have gone through several of their axles.

Thank you. I called Hartland and talked to a really nice man who told us what to do, what info we needed from the tags on the axels, and to take pics of the tires and bent axles. We have done everything he said. Now we have to call Lippert. Yes, they are Lippert axles. I wish I could get better axels that are heavier duty but they will only replace what is on the TT. What happened with your axles?

I will keep you updated on this........ we were told NOT to tow the TT, but we sure hadn't planned on it.

 

[wdk450]

Re: Tire and axel failure in 2011 BRS28 - HELP!!!!!!!!!

RanCarr:
In previous years, Heartland owners who had significant Lippert product problems have had on-site service calls done by a mobile Lippert employee.

 

[DougS]

Re: Tire and axel failure in 2011 BRS28 - HELP!!!!!!!!!

RanCarr,
Mine is a long story, covered several times on the forum. From my first flat axle I thought Lippert had defective axles probably from a certain production period. Now I upgraded to 8K axles from 7K and all is good. Having my rig weighed, I was never over weight. Probably their production problems are behind them.
Good Luck.

 

[RanCarr]

Re: Tire and axel failure in 2011 BRS28 - HELP!!!!!!!!!

RanCarr,
Mine is a long story, covered several times on the forum. From my first flat axle I thought Lippert had defective axles probably from a certain production period. Now I upgraded to 8K axles from 7K and all is good. Having my rig weighed, I was never over weight. Probably their production problems are behind them.
Good Luck.

It looks like we will have to upgrade at our own expense also. Heatland feels they're not responsible for defective axles and the destroyed tires. Or that the payload is so small on this BRS28. They passed the buck to Lippert. We contacted Lippert and they only warranty them for one year. They are willing to send us replacement tubes... tubes that are not adequate for a TT this size OR were installed incorrectly and not "inline". They will surely bend again just as these have. There is little payload for food, clothing and camping gear once a battery and two propane tanks are added. Also add the anti-sway bars and the WDH. Also add at least 15 gallons of water to wash hands and flush the toilet. Please take the time to read this from another reply:

"If I was a trailer maker and knowningly making things "at the edge" of their maximum loads, I would never admit it. Never. If I did, the lawyers would have me pinned down faster than an Olympic runner. You can try contacting trailer makers if you want. But, don't think you'll get far. Especially if one's trailer is no longer under warranty. Legally, they don't even need to answer your phone calls.

Down to the details.... (for the BRS28)

Surf: - click here - and focus on their listed numbers. GVWR = 6,900 lbs. This is the recommended MAX amount of trailer chassis weight and its maximum load. Its axle info is (2) 3,500 lbs (or max 7,000 lbs). Just by comparing these simple numbers, I can tell the trailer's suspension is build "on the edge". Yes. Its within the legal numbers. But, "on the edge" of going over. Especially since its dry weight is 5,180 lbs. If wondering, "dry is dry". If one adds AC, battery, clothes, food, TV/DVD Players, etc. etc, its "normally loaded weight" is often within 1,5000 - 1,800 lbs range. Take 5,180 + minimum 1,500 = 6,680 lbs. If one loads heavy (with another 500 lbs), then the TT's GVWR is over. And, one didn't even hit a bump.

For the fix...

With above in mind, I would simply replace the existing factory 2 x 3,500 lbs axles with 2 x 5,200 lbs axles and next high size rubber tires as well. re: Instead of factory ST205/75R14-C, do investigate the much stronger 225s with higher D "load" range as well. And, I'd install leaf spring packs for 8,000-8,500 lbs load (instead of its current 7,000 lbs max load). Yes. It sounds like an over build. re: Next size up axles (which also creates next size up electric brakes), and next size up tires. But in the long run, its well worth it. Especially if you don't like trailer suspensions built "on their edge" of max loading numbers.

Note: Over building doesn't mean one can purposely load more. It means one is building for extra bufffers. Especially for the harsh double railways tracks and other unexpected sudden impact loads.

For a $20,000 RV/TT that needs suspesnion upgrades, I'd simply upgrade its axles, leaf spring packs and tires (for $1,000-$1,500 or so as a DIY project). I would't like it (re: correcting a weak factory build) but this 1:20 ratio fix sounds worth it to me... Especially if one keeps their trailers for years and years." End.

Now where does this leave us? We can pay from our own pocked to upgrade as this poster suggests so we can actually use this BRS28 safely, or we can take the chance with our lives and haul this TT with it's dangerous situation somewhere to have the replacement axles Lippert will send, that are not suitable for this TT, and will only bend again - should that happen, we will be stuck to replace another 4 tires and probably still have to upgrade. As you can imagine, we are totally disgusted with both HL and Lippert.

If the axles were installed INCORRECTLY as HL seems to believe, then they should be completely replaced and *reset*, as when the new tubes are installed, if we survive hauling this TT into the city, the new tubes will not be in-line either, and will ruin the new tires we have to pay for - for someone elses mistake and shoddy workmanship (at Lippert).

Again, where does this leave us?

 

[danemayer]

Rancarr,

You've quoted from someone who is misinformed.

First of all, approximately 10% of the GVWR is carried by the hitch (tongue weight), not by the axles. So right off the bat, if you were loaded up right to the max, the weight on the axles would be about 6210 (6900 GVWR - 690 tongue weight), leaving your axles with a significant margin before they're at their rated weight, plus whatever additional margin Lippert may have designed in when they rated them.

Second, the dry weight of 5180 allows you 1720 pounds of optional equipment and gear. Appliances like furnace, A/C, radio that are part of the standard equipment, are part of the dry weight. If you could buy an optional 2nd A/C (which I don't think you can on this trailer), that would not be part of the dry weight.

1720 pounds of stuff is a lot. We could argue about whether the average family carries 800 pounds of stuff, and whether full-timers carry more, but 1720 is a lot; even if you carry 15 gallons of water (about 100 pounds). If you want to know exactly how much stuff you're carrying, and you should, get the loaded trailer weighed at a CAT Scale and then you'll know.

For the axles to be loaded at their rated weight of 7000, you'd have to be carrying 790 pounds more than the 1720 the Heartland allowed for. That would put your actual trailer weight 10% over the GVWR. If you think this is possible, you should get the rig weighed to confirm it. If you're overloaded, you can look yourself in the mirror and decide whether to lighten the load or move up to a larger trailer. Towing an overweight trailer is dangerous and will cause failure of various components. Among other things, it would expose you to tire blowouts.

But as long as you're not collecting rocks as souvenirs, I doubt very much that you've managed to overload your trailer or your axles. So maybe you should accept Lippert's offer and then get the loaded trailer weighed to find out what you're dealing with and go from there.

 

[RanCarr]

Rancarr,

You've quoted from someone who is misinformed.

First of all, approximately 10% of the GVWR is carried by the hitch (tongue weight), not by the axles. So right off the bat, if you were loaded up right to the max, the weight on the axles would be about 6210 (6900 GVWR - 690 tongue weight), leaving your axles with a significant margin before they're at their rated weight, plus whatever additional margin Lippert may have designed in when they rated them.

Second, the dry weight of 5180 allows you 1720 pounds of optional equipment and gear. Appliances like furnace, A/C, radio that are part of the standard equipment, are part of the dry weight. If you could buy an optional 2nd A/C (which I don't think you can on this trailer), that would not be part of the dry weight.

1720 pounds of stuff is a lot. We could argue about whether the average family carries 800 pounds of stuff, and whether full-timers carry more, but 1720 is a lot; even if you carry 15 gallons of water (about 100 pounds). If you want to know exactly how much stuff you're carrying, and you should, get the loaded trailer weighed at a CAT Scale and then you'll know.

I spent 15 minutes earlier replying to you and because the Server was "busy" again, the entire post was lost. So I'll try this again. We travel as light as possible because we are towing with a GMC 1500. We have no choice but to "go lightly." After we resolve this problem we will weight the TT at a local truck stop but I know, because of the GMC 1500, the TV is not overloaded. Also, we're two seniors and have no need or desire to drag all kinds of stuff with us. RR tracks and dips in the roads and interstates can't be avoided. We've hit no pot holes. We never had an accident with the NT. There is weight we can't remove as they're necessities, not options. These are the battery, the two 20g propane tanks, the WDH and the anti-sway bars. These weigh quite a bit. At least half of the generous storage space in the BRS28 is empty.

For the axles to be loaded at their rated weight of 7000, you'd have to be carrying 790 pounds more than the 1720 the Heartland allowed for. That would put your actual trailer weight 10% over the GVWR. If you think this is possible, you should get the rig weighed to confirm it. If you're overloaded, you can look yourself in the mirror and decide whether to lighten the load or move up to a larger trailer. Towing an overweight trailer is dangerous and will cause failure of various components. Among other things, it would expose you to tire blowouts.

We're not novices and know how dangerous overloaded TTs can be. We read the Forums, talk to other campers and snow-birds. We had a Sunline and a Crossroads Zinger before we bought the NT. We bought the NT for more space for us and the cats, not for more storage space. Even the little Sunline had enough storage space for our clothing, bedding, an outdoor grill, a few books and food - the usual stuff most campers take along. Tight squeeze but we fit and took a trip over 2000 miles that year in it. Again, our TV is only a 1500 and is 13 yrs old so we have to travel with as little "stuff" as possible. And why drag stuff that's not needed?!?! Some RVs look like those Hoarders homes. How can they tolerate all that junk? And yet they seem totally unconcerned about the weight.

But as long as you're not collecting rocks as souvenirs, I doubt very much that you've managed to overload your trailer or your axles. So maybe you should accept Lippert's offer and then get the loaded trailer weighed to find out what you're dealing with and go from there.

I don't know what my husband will decide to do in the end. We're in the process of discussing it. Since we travel so lightly as it is we can't help feeling the replacement axles will also bend and destroy another set of 4 tires. There is nothing we can get rid of from the NT and still be able to camp and snow-bird comfortably with it. DH is leaning toward getting the heavier duty axle, springs... whatever, for our safety on the roads.

 

[RanCarr]

Re: Tire and axle failure in 2011 BRS28 - HELP!!!!!!!!! Pictures

Here are pics of 2 of the four tires. All are ruined and have less than 3000 miles on them. You can see the bent axle. If you Google Lippert recalls you will find hundreds of posts and information on the problems people have with them. It makes me wonder why the RV industry would even use these axles considering all the problems they have.

[

 

[danemayer]

RanCarr,

I'm just trying to help you understand that unless your weigh-in shows something different, you're not overloading these axles, and based on your posts, you have plenty of margin in the load you're putting on them. I can't tell you why they didn't hold up, except to say that we're not seeing a lot of posts such as might indicate a widespread problem. Whichever way you decide to go, I hope it corrects the problem and allays your concerns.

 

[RanCarr]

RanCarr,

I'm just trying to help you understand that unless your weigh-in shows something different, you're not overloading these axles, and based on your posts, you have plenty of margin in the load you're putting on them. I can't tell you why they didn't hold up, except to say that we're not seeing a lot of posts such as might indicate a widespread problem. Whichever way you decide to go, I hope it corrects the problem and allays your concerns.

Yes, thank you. We have agreed to accept the 2 replacement axles from Lippert. But they will only send them to a Repair Shop. We now have to find such a place and take the chance of getting the RV there. We will have to pay for the ruined tires. Lippert will pay for 3 hours of labor.

 

[westxsrt10]

Yes, thank you. We have agreed to accept the 2 replacement axles from Lippert. But they will only send them to a Repair Shop. We now have to find such a place and take the chance of getting the RV there. We will have to pay for the ruined tires. Lippert will pay for 3 hours of labor.

Chances are the new axles will solve your problem. I'd still buy some better tires (D rated Maxxis)

(Don't overload your Equalizer hitch as that can place too much weight on your trailer axles.)

 

[JeremyN]

RanCarr,

I have the same problem with my 2011 North Trail 28BRS. Actually, my axles are getting replaced this upcoming week. Lippert covered 3 hours of labor, new axles, upgraded 3" tubes, and all hardware needed to complete the job. The Dealer just has to transfer over my brake assemblies. They are also giving me partial credit for 4 new tires as well.

I will tell you this (and I told Heartland and Lippert this as well), I will be under my trailer with a level after each trip I make. Lets just keep our fingers crossed that they don't bend and I won't have to talk to Heartland or Lippert again about this.

I also know for sure, that I do not overload my trailer. Ever! So we will just have to see what the future holds!

 

[KaosAD]

I've seen quite a few bent axle threads here and over at RV.net as well, mainly Lippert . I too have bent axles on a 7 month old North Trail. Heartland gave me the run around and pretty much told me I wasn't qualified to determine that the axles were bent and to take it to a Heartland approved shop for them to take pics and measurements. I live in my North Trail full time which makes it tough to just "go to the shop". Anyhoo, I called Lippert, sent them pics I took and a few other measurements they wanted and whenever I'm ready they'll send the axles and parts to a shop of my choosing which will be in May.

I wanted to add that my axles look exactly like yours in the pic RanCarr and I am not over weight, my GVW is 6,900 and I scale out at 6,200.