Tow Max Blowout and Cyclone Damage

[lwmcguir]

When RVers towing their trailers pass me at 75mph, that makes my comfort level extremely uncomfortable. It's okay for the truckers but I don't think our houses on wheel were built for that kind of speed. Consider additional stress that is caused on the mechanical parts of the suspension alone.

We get passed all the time (by Heartland rigs) when we are doing the speed limit which sometimes is 75 mph. I always wonder how many of these are the folks that have blow outs later on and wonder why. If you want to keep up with the traffic on the interstate the only safe legal way is to upgrade to 17.5" tires/wheels.

 

[BarneyFife]

I'm not trying to be snarky, but I think our perception of value needs to be reconsidered. $55k for a (rolling) house with garage. Sounds like a real deal! The products the "builder" (Heartland) used in construction were intended to keep the price down, while giving us the luxury of a much pricier home. It happens that some of these products, most not mfg by Heartland, fail earlier than expected. Would you have paid $65k for this house/garage, if it had better brakes, better water pump, better wall boarder, better fenders?

If we want long-lasting, better quality, less headaches.... in a capitalistic society, we probably have to spend $$ to get it... And it seems it's always more than we can afford.... LOL!

Overall, the trailer does what it's intended... Let's you have a roof over your head, with water, electric, sewer, and a place to haul your toys, wherever you so desire, anywhere in this great country! I hope you can find a way to enjoy it, because that's what it's all about!!!

E


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

You make a good case but traditionally when one gets in this type of situation, they look back at their own history. Our first camper, a 30' Puma travel trailer we bought new in 2004. Had it four years, pulled it to Disney twice and countless trips in-between. Only problem we ever had was a bad fan motor on the AC replaced under warranty. In other words, that $17,500 camper was by far a better built unit than my Cyclone. Our second, a new Palomino Sabre travel trailer in 2010 we had for one year. Zero problems but we sold it to move up to a nicer toy hauler which would become this Cyclone. Call it a rolling house with a garage is fair. But compared to our past "rolling houses", its a failure.

Your last comment is what's so depressing. My wife, two sons, and I have been RV'ing since that Puma in April 2004. Its the only way we vacation and the memories we've created will last a lifetime. But for the first time since then, RV'ing has lost something. Every time we plan for a trip, we have that constant feeling of "what's going to break this time?"

 

[BarneyFife]

I am just wondering out of all of those things listed wrong with the Cyclone how many were fixed for free under warranty? If they were then what is the problem other than the aggravation of having it in the shop. If you wanted to see my issues I wont have enough room on this page to list them, but on the other hand Heartland has stood behind their product. Also if I am correct the list price on that Cyclone is close to $80000 and you got it for $55000. Wow that is quite a discount. Did you complain when you got that discount? I think not. Just saying we have all had various items fail on our units and they will continue to fail due to the way we use them, the condition of the road, what we carry in them, how often we maintain them etc. Just keep in mind nothing made by machine or man is trouble free, especially RVs. I have talked to many RVers, from those that own pop-ups to those with Beavers and Prevosts and when you get in an honest conversation with them they will all admit to issues with their units. So, like my Dad used to say, we have to learn to 'Bend with the wind, like a tree" and hope the wind is not so strong it breaks us. Lets smile, be happy and go go go RVing enjoying the time we have left on this good ole earth. Happy Travels!!

Let's break this one down.

1. Warranty or not, its spent more time in the shop than it has at the campgrounds.
2. Everyone has complimented Heartland on how they've stood behind their product. I think that's great. But for us, we've been blown off the three times we've had to talk with them. I'm not exaggerating anything here. I think we're just an exception to the norm but they still didn't care when we called. It really was the feeling of "just get this guy off the phone."
3. What does the discount have to do with Heartland? They make the same money on the camper if I had paid $1 or $100,000. Toot your horn at RV Outlet if you think I got too much of a deal.
4. I've bent over and over again. At some point, that tree is either going to break or toughen up. I'm not breaking.
5. The smiles we used to have RV'ing will most likely return when this camper is gone and another brand toy hauler is under the garage out back.

 

[TedS]

If BarneyFife wanted just the basics, a roof, water, electricity, sewer, and a garage, I'm sure he could have paid a lot less. We have all done what we thought was the stepup to more, expecting better to be included. What we seem to be getting is 'what everybody else builds with'. The expense seems to go into the pretty and nice looking and not so much into better basics. Warranty is good if you have to use it. Seems the builders could keep more money(=profit) if they build to spend less on warranty.
IMHO

 

[RCF]

When RVers towing their trailers pass me at 75mph, that makes my comfort level extremely uncomfortable. It's okay for the truckers but I don't think our houses on wheel were built for that kind of speed. Consider additional stress that is caused on the mechanical parts of the suspension alone.

To be clear, nowhere in my post did I condone, recommend or even mention actually towing at 75mph, which I do not do. Dan mentioned safety margin - was just letting him know there's actually a little more margin there than he thought he had.

 

[RCF]

RCF,

If I'm reading the tables correctly, although the G614 is rated at up to 75, the nominal speed is 65. To safely carry the max load at 75mph, you have to increase the tire pressure by 10psi - from 110 to 120 psi. BUT, you can't increase it to a value higher than the rating of the wheel/rim which I believe is 110 psi on our rigs. So if I understand it correctly, driving with G614s at 75 mph with a max load and tires at 110 psi means you're effectively overloading the tire, weakening it and setting up a future failure.

And even if you had wheels that allowed you to increase tire pressure to 120, the load tables don't give you any increase in load capacity. So I think I just get the improvement of dropping from 65 to 55, which looks like it might be around 5% (maybe as much as 9%). But I'll hazard a guess that my 300 pound weight margin (8% of 3750) might be additive with the 5% reduced speed margin. I'll take it.

Dan,

The G614 is rated at 75mph at it's listed max load rating (http://www.goodyear.com/cfmx/web/truck/line.cfm?prodline=160007, then click "tire spec's"). Other tires are rated at 65mph, but can be raised to higher mph by giving up load rating (the tables specifically say that it is for using the 65mph rated tires for up to 75mph). I had to read it through a few times to make sure I was reading this correctly, but I am confident that I am.

Clint

 

[danemayer]

Dan,

The G614 is rated at 75mph at it's listed max load rating (http://www.goodyear.com/cfmx/web/truck/line.cfm?prodline=160007, then click "tire spec's"). Other tires are rated at 65mph, but can be raised to higher mph by giving up load rating (the tables specifically say that it is for using the 65mph rated tires for up to 75mph). I had to read it through a few times to make sure I was reading this correctly, but I am confident that I am.

Clint

Clint,

Take a look at this doc, 1st line of the table on the 2nd page. I think it's saying that from 66-75 mph you need to bump the inflation from 110 to 120psi.

Is that how you would interpret it?

 

[RCF]

Clint,

Take a look at this doc, 1st line of the table on the 2nd page. I think it's saying that from 66-75 mph you need to bump the inflation from 110 to 120psi.

Is that how you would interpret it?

No. At the top of that same page, it says "I[FONT=TradeGothicLTStd*1][FONT=TradeGothicLTStd*1]n addition[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=TradeGothicLTStd*2][FONT=TradeGothicLTStd*2], [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=TradeGothicLTStd*1][FONT=TradeGothicLTStd*1]the Tire and Rim [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=TradeGothicLTStd*7][FONT=TradeGothicLTStd*7]A[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=TradeGothicLTStd*1][FONT=TradeGothicLTStd*1]ssociation also permits operating a [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=TradeGothicLTStd*10][FONT=TradeGothicLTStd*10]6[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=TradeGothicLTStd*3][FONT=TradeGothicLTStd*3]5 [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=TradeGothicLTStd*1][FONT=TradeGothicLTStd*1]mph rated tire at higher speeds with a reduced load and increased inflation." The G614 is rated at 75mph already, not 65mph. [/FONT][/FONT]

 

[TravelTiger]

I hope folks don't feel the need to drive over 65, whether their tires can do it or not. Speed over 55 kills more often, a proven fact in highway statistics. Why, when hauling an additional 3-8 TONS, would you want to go FASTER than 65?

 

[RCF]

Sorry for sidetracking the thread . . .

FYI for all, the only reason I brought up the speed rating of the G614 is because if you use the table Dan mentioned and linked, you can deduct that since the G614 is rated for 75mph, it's load rating should be higher when traveling at speeds less than 75mph, just as the table shows for 65mph tires, and hence a higher "safety margin".

 

[TravelTiger]

Sorry for sidetracking the thread . . .

FYI for all, the only reason I brought up the speed rating of the G614 is because if you use the table Dan mentioned and linked, you can deduct that since the G614 is rated for 75mph, it's load rating should be higher when traveling at speeds less than 75mph, just as the table shows for 65mph tires, and hence a higher "safety margin".

I'm sorry for taking of thread with my mini-rant, too. I understand the desire for extra safety.

 

[Sumo]

To increase my "safety margin" , I when from a D (the 8 ply that came on the 5th wheel) to an E (10 ply).
I don't tow any faster or load any heavier.

 

[porthole]

Goodyear G114's, 17.5"

American made, high quality, high load capacity strong sidewalls and what appears to be long lasting tread (so far).

Got 5500 miles on the old TowMax tires before I had a problem (bubble, belt shift slow leak), and I admit it might have been a bit overloaded. 3 tires are still in good shape and show no abnormal wear or shifting.

Currently have 9600 miles on the 114's and they look great.
Highly recommend these for the quality and peace of mind. And there have been no secrets with how Goodyear has treated RV'ers with tire issues.

 

[mattpopp]

For the money I would shy away from the G614. When you can get a Hi-Spec Alu wheel and Cooper Road Master for $460. Rated at 4805lbs and a much stronger sidewall then the G614. These tires have a much longer road life as they are still good after 6 or 7 years before needing replacement. This is the option I would consider on a Tandem Axle TH. Triple axle you could proably get away with the G614 and be fine.

I just got the price a few minutes ago, Shipped to me in houston on those was like $1950. http://www.trailertiresandwheels.com/site/1284278/page/910782 They dont have the tire listed on the website. Now I just have to convince the wife we need these

 

[lwmcguir]

For the money I would shy away from the G614. When you can get a Hi-Spec Alu wheel and Cooper Road Master for $460. Rated at 4805lbs and a much stronger sidewall then the G614. These tires have a much longer road life as they are still good after 6 or 7 years before needing replacement. This is the option I would consider on a Tandem Axle TH. Triple axle you could proably get away with the G614 and be fine.

I just got the price a few minutes ago, Shipped to me in houston on those was like $1950. http://www.trailertiresandwheels.com/site/1284278/page/910782 They dont have the tire listed on the website. Now I just have to convince the wife we need these

I agree 100%. Small amount of money difference if you don't have to buy wheels. you get a lot more tire. The 17.5's are very long lived. I have some on cattle trailers that are 20 years old and very weather checked. Those trailers aren't used on the hi-way however but they still haul cattle.

 

[mattpopp]

I spoke to my wife about switching to 17.5's. Needless to say that conversation did not go over to well. Looks like I am going to have to wait until a tire blows out and tears up the side of the trailer. With a 2,000 mile rd trip in Sept. Kind of concern.

 

[Urban350]

Just check for the tire splitting along the seem on the inside and outside of the tires looks kind of like cuts in the side wall

 

[Herbiesrig]

Unless you haven't been in a situation where a tire blew, wrecked the wheel, ripped up the skirting You have no idea how important good tires are. DH is a fanatic about his tires. Years ago he was pulling a race car in Florida, a tire blew he rolled the truck and trailer with race car on. He had new tires on the trailer. He was lucky that he only got a few scrapes. Now, years later, if the tires don't look right, wear right, causes a Red flag and he most generally ends up finding the problem and get new tires. He never skimps on safety

 

[TravelTiger]

I discovered our really bad TowMax when I was under the trailer taking pics of the suspension, at home. Ran my hand over the tread from the inside of the tire and found a slight bulge.

Once the TowMax was removed, this is what it looked like:



This tire was our 1 year old spare that had only been on the ground only 500 miles.

Once I looked back at photos of the tandem, I could see a slight "enlargement" of this tire compared to the one next to it. The report was that belts inside the tire had failed, and was a blowout waiting to happen.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[BarneyFife]

The tires I referred to in this thread opening had a similar issue. One had done very similar to what you pictured here and of course, the other which had complete tread separation.

As many of us know now to consider pricing any new camper with an upgraded tire at the dealership. If they won't do a swap, I'll take my money elsewhere. No sense in paying for something you're going to change out right away.