What would cause this?

[Keywestwego]

Just pulled into our driveway and noticed this. What has happened?

Can I fix it and what search do I do to find someone more knowledgeable than I to look at how to do the repair.

This is on a 2012 Landmark we just purchased in Jan. '18.

If I didn't have bad luck.....you know the rest.....

 

[danemayer]

Compare the gap with weight on the hitch versus weight on the landing gear. If the gap changes more than 1/4", you may have frame flex (a problem with the upper frame where the pinbox is mounted). If you see the gap change, put your camera on a fixed object so you can get clear pictures in both conditions. Tape a ruler to the area so the gap can be measured.

If you have frame flex, call Heartland Customer Service at 877-262-8032 / 574-262-8030. Have your VIN # ready. Have the pictures ready.

 

[Keywestwego]

Compare the gap with weight on the hitch versus weight on the landing gear. If the gap changes more than 1/4", you may have frame flex (a problem with the upper frame where the pinbox is mounted). If you see the gap change, put your camera on a fixed object so you can get clear pictures in both conditions. Tape a ruler to the area so the gap can be measured.

If you have frame flex, call Heartland Customer Service at 877-262-8032 / 574-262-8030. Have your VIN # ready. Have the pictures ready.

Thank you danemayer. I will look it over this coming week. Have to get all my "to do's" done this week cause the following week I get a new knee!!!!!

 

[SNOKING]

That appears to be a major frame issue with the front overhang. As noted contact Heartland and see if they and/or Lippert will help with the repair. Was the purchase from a dealer that gave you any kind of warranty? Chris

 

[Keywestwego]

That appears to be a major frame issue with the front overhang. As noted contact Heartland and see if they and/or Lippert will help with the repair. Was the purchase from a dealer that gave you any kind of warranty? Chris

Unfortunately no. From an individual.

 

[SNOKING]

Unfortunately no. From an individual.

You might also want to read your insurance policy on it carefully to see if that may help, before talking to the agent.

 

[JohnDar]

I second the idea to contact Heartland first. With the VIN, they may be able to tell if there was any frame repair done to it, or if it falls into the build series that presented with this problem (and your’s just now went). Funny, though, that it happened after you purchased it used. That problem usually showed up shortly after the original purchase.

On a “happier” note, it may just be that the panel came loose and it’s not the frame. Having worked on my overhang, there aren’t a lot of attachment points securing it from the factory. Between the sides, the only fasteners in mine were for the small light over the cargo door.

I would contact your insurance carrier as a last resort. They may say your trailer is damaged goods and think twice about continuing to cover it.


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[Keywestwego]

I second the idea to contact Heartland first. With the VIN, they may be able to tell if there was any frame repair done to it, or if it falls into the build series that presented with this problem (and your’s just now went). Funny, though, that it happened after you purchased it used. That problem usually showed up shortly after the original purchase.

On a “happier” note, it may just be that the panel came loose and it’s not the frame. Having worked on my overhang, there aren’t a lot of attachment points securing it from the factory. Between the sides, the only fasteners in mine were for the small light over the cargo door.

I would contact your insurance carrier as a last resort. They may say your trailer is damaged goods and think twice about continuing to cover it.


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Will do.

First photo is with weight on hitch (3/4" gap at center of curve). Second photo is with weight on front supports lifted off hitch (1/8" gap at center of curve). I also noticed buckeling on the front panel and there is a crack now. Ugh.

 

[danemayer]

Will do.

First photo is with weight on hitch (3/4" gap at center of curve). Second photo is with weight on front supports lifted off hitch (1/8" gap at center of curve). I also noticed buckeling on the front panel and there is a crack now. Ugh.View attachment 57529View attachment 57530View attachment 57531

Looks like frame flex. Heartland can advise. Heartland and Lippert often take care of this as a goodwill gesture, even on older trailers. But that's usually for the original purchaser. For second owners, it's iffier. But phone calls don't cost much. If you get put on hold, I'd suggest staying on the line until someone picks up.

 

[JohnDar]

Another indicator of frame flex is the bedroom floor. Moving about, listen for creaking/squeaking and/or ridges under the carpet. These were my early warnings of a problem at the end of the first season we had ours. Actually, the dealer’s service writer picked up on it when I brought it in for some other maintenance and told her about the squeaking floor. Got fixed under warranty.


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[SNOKING]

Will do.

First photo is with weight on hitch (3/4" gap at center of curve). Second photo is with weight on front supports lifted off hitch (1/8" gap at center of curve). I also noticed buckeling on the front panel and there is a crack now. Ugh.View attachment 57529View attachment 57530View attachment 57531

"Houston", we have a problem!
This is more than flex. Steel and/or welds have broken.

 

[JohnDar]

"Houston", we have a problem!
This is more than flex. Steel and/or welds have broken.

Usually the flex is the result of broken welds, and in earlier cases, lack of reinforcement around some critical points. Fix is usually rewelding and installing additional metal gussets at critical points. Involves removing most of the front cap to do it (per my service report).


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[danemayer]

"Houston", we have a problem!
This is more than flex. Steel and/or welds have broken.

You're correct. It's typically broken bolts or broken welds, or both. It's commonly referred to as "frame flex" because the frame appears to flex as weight is transferred from hitch to landing gear.

 

[Keywestwego]

You're correct. It's typically broken bolts or broken welds, or both. It's commonly referred to as "frame flex" because the frame appears to flex as weight is transferred from hitch to landing gear.

Thank you to all that have given me info to go on.

 

[mlpeloquin]

Very familiar with this. Opens up when on hitch and closes when lifted off the hitch. Cause was fasteners heads snapped off holding the two frames together. Was repaired by the removal of the side trim and front skin. New fasteners were of a heaver gauge and doubled up. No problems since and have traveled over California's best roads! I did change out the king pin to a Trailair Flexair so the road shock is not transferred to the frame fasteners. This along with the Airlift air bags gives the truck a very good ride. I suspect that I caught this early and the frame welds were still good. Fasteners are self drilling/self tapping screws.

 

[Keywestwego]

Yep, that's it. Did you do the repair or was it under warranty?

Very familiar with this. Opens up when on hitch and closes when lifted off the hitch. Cause was fasteners heads snapped off holding the two frames together. Was repaired by the removal of the side trim and front skin. New fasteners were of a heaver gauge and doubled up. No problems since and have traveled over California's best roads! I did change out the king pin to a Trailair Flexair so the road shock is not transferred to the frame fasteners. This along with the Airlift air bags gives the truck a very good ride. I suspect that I caught this early and the frame welds were still good. Fasteners are self drilling/self tapping screws.

View attachment 57548

 

[mlpeloquin]

Yep, that's it. Did you do the repair or was it under warranty?

Warranty was passed by a few months. I paid for the opening up of the front. After several picture and a movie made by my independent repair facility, Heartland contacted Lippert. From the evidence of the pictures Lippert, Heartland, and my installer all agreed that the frames were fine and not damaged. After a few weeks Heartland chipped in a good faith amount that covered about 45% of the cost. I did not expect Heartland to do anything, but wanted their opinion on just how to fix this. Heartland was great. Mine fifth wheel was over a year old. I would not expect any help with a fifth wheel many years past the warranty and not being owned by the original owner though.

If you have the room at home, put old blankets down. Remove the trim around the edges and unscrew the skin. Inspect the frames for problems with the welds. If the welds are good, then clamp the frames in place and install new fasteners. Use a heaver fastener and double them up. My repair facility used the heaver fasteners and longer ones so that they would go through both sets of frame walls.

Note that I have met another couple in an RV park with SOB that was a month old. Same problem. Seems know matter what brand the frames are all installed together the same way. I was told that they used to be welded, but the welds were failing so the industry went to self drilling/tapping fasteners.

 

[Keywestwego]

UPDATE on my issue.......


Over two weeks ago I called Heartland for "help" on the issue I have and what I have learned is frame flex.

1. No return call from anyone!

So, I am going to have a master welder beef up my front end and chalk it up to a lesson learned. The previous owners says they knew nothing about it and for the most part I believe them. They kept meticulous repair receipts, which I got when I bought the rig. The only strange thing is this happened on our FIRST outing since we purchased it.

I am not going to bash the previous owners but I will say, so far, I am unimpressed with Heartlands customer service.

Hope the rest of you enjoy your summer camping and traveling, which is what we were going to be doing. Instead......repair work!!

 

[mlpeloquin]

Just to let you know that at my repair facility I was told that the industry used to weld the frames together instead of using fasteners. The welds would develop stress cracks over time and had the same problem. Use longer heaver gauge self tapping screws and double up on them. So far it has worked for me.

 

[Oldelevatorman]

Just met a fellow Landmark owner in Coeur D'Alene on his way to Elkhart for the exact same problem on his 2012. Frame flex. He's scheduled in the first week of June!


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