Wheel Bearing Repacking
- Thread starter JeffG1947
- Start date
danemayer
Well-known member
If it's a Dexter axle, the booklet they gave out at the Gillette Rally shows a maintenance interval of 12 months, which is also what they said in their presentation at the rally. I'm not sure, but I think Lippert is the same. Interestingly, the Heartland Trailer Manual shows a 6 month maintenance interval.
Jeff,
I've probably written about this subject 3-5 times. You might do a search for my posts and get them. If not then I'll give you a quick run through. Will you be doing your own packing?? If so then here's what one could do. This is what I and several on this forum also do. The first thing I'd do is replace the China bearings with a good brand. Koyo is one as well as Timken (sp). Your best bet is to take one set of bearings and seal to an industrial bearing supplier. They'll be able to get good bearings. It will cost you about $100 for all 4 wheels. Replace races as well as bearings. My advice is to also not use the zerk to pack the bearings. Two things. Forcing grease into the axle then into the bearings fills the hub with grease and may force the grease out the seal and all over your brake linings. There have been several posts showing the results. Just pack the bearing by hand and put a thin layer of lube inside the hub to reduce moisture build up. Packing the hub with grease acts as an insulator which prevents the heat from escaping. Use nothing other than a synthetic bearing lube. There are several available: Mobil 1, Amzoil, Red Line. I'm familiar with the first two but Red Line came highly recommended as well. An industrial bearing supplier may also recommend one. Now how often???? That's a good question. When we had rear wheel drive vehicles we only packed the front bearings when we did a brake job which was after 35K-45K miles. Why would trailer brakes be any different??? I believe it's a holdover from boat trailers which get immersed into water often and therefore needed to be purged, so the packed bearing every year. They also used the zerk fitting to force the grease into the hub. I check my bearing every 2 years. One might feel more comfortable inspecting the bearings and brakes every year and that's fine. I wouldn't pay to have it done because I believe it's unnecessary. I did get one response that said but we really tax our bearings by putting a good load on them as opposed to a car or truck. I believe that the TT manufacturers put large enough bearings to handle the loads we place on our units. If do we overload them then we can expect problems and not only from the bearing but from the tires as well.
Also be careful when adjusting the bearing clearance. This procedure never failed me in 40 years of working on vehicles. Tighten the spindle nut about 1/8th to 1/4 turn with a ratchet. Spin the wheel to spread the grease around. This first tighten is to assure that everything is seated correctly, race, and seals. Now loosen the nut and turn it by hand while wiggling the tire by grabbing it at either 12 or 6 o'clock. Turn the nut with your fingers until the movement just goes away. That will give you between .003- .005 thousands of bearing clearance. Install your cotter pin. If you have to move the nut to get the cotter pin to line up always loosen it. My unit has a keeper that allows me to keep the nut where I want it and simply move the keeper. Hope this helps.
TeJay
I've probably written about this subject 3-5 times. You might do a search for my posts and get them. If not then I'll give you a quick run through. Will you be doing your own packing?? If so then here's what one could do. This is what I and several on this forum also do. The first thing I'd do is replace the China bearings with a good brand. Koyo is one as well as Timken (sp). Your best bet is to take one set of bearings and seal to an industrial bearing supplier. They'll be able to get good bearings. It will cost you about $100 for all 4 wheels. Replace races as well as bearings. My advice is to also not use the zerk to pack the bearings. Two things. Forcing grease into the axle then into the bearings fills the hub with grease and may force the grease out the seal and all over your brake linings. There have been several posts showing the results. Just pack the bearing by hand and put a thin layer of lube inside the hub to reduce moisture build up. Packing the hub with grease acts as an insulator which prevents the heat from escaping. Use nothing other than a synthetic bearing lube. There are several available: Mobil 1, Amzoil, Red Line. I'm familiar with the first two but Red Line came highly recommended as well. An industrial bearing supplier may also recommend one. Now how often???? That's a good question. When we had rear wheel drive vehicles we only packed the front bearings when we did a brake job which was after 35K-45K miles. Why would trailer brakes be any different??? I believe it's a holdover from boat trailers which get immersed into water often and therefore needed to be purged, so the packed bearing every year. They also used the zerk fitting to force the grease into the hub. I check my bearing every 2 years. One might feel more comfortable inspecting the bearings and brakes every year and that's fine. I wouldn't pay to have it done because I believe it's unnecessary. I did get one response that said but we really tax our bearings by putting a good load on them as opposed to a car or truck. I believe that the TT manufacturers put large enough bearings to handle the loads we place on our units. If do we overload them then we can expect problems and not only from the bearing but from the tires as well.
Also be careful when adjusting the bearing clearance. This procedure never failed me in 40 years of working on vehicles. Tighten the spindle nut about 1/8th to 1/4 turn with a ratchet. Spin the wheel to spread the grease around. This first tighten is to assure that everything is seated correctly, race, and seals. Now loosen the nut and turn it by hand while wiggling the tire by grabbing it at either 12 or 6 o'clock. Turn the nut with your fingers until the movement just goes away. That will give you between .003- .005 thousands of bearing clearance. Install your cotter pin. If you have to move the nut to get the cotter pin to line up always loosen it. My unit has a keeper that allows me to keep the nut where I want it and simply move the keeper. Hope this helps.
TeJay
JohnDar
Prolifically Gabby Member
This is what it says in the Lippert manual. Expert mechanics may question this, but since I'm not a mechanic, I pretty much follow this. Even though we don't run anywhere near 12,000 miles, or even 1200 miles a year, I get it done annually.
Bearing grease should be replaced every 12,000 miles or 12 months,
whichever comes first.
Bearing grease should be replaced every 12,000 miles or 12 months,
whichever comes first.
John,
I do understand why some do what they do and if one feels comfortable then that's OK. My only interest is to educate those that have to do repairs and maintenance so they don't do things that cost them $$$$ when it is not necessary. If possible I like to share what I learned and perhaps can direct others to use ideas, techniques, tools, lubricants etc. to accomplish better maintenance on their rigs. Remember that these are only my opinions but they are based on 35 years teaching and learning automotive service and repair. I learned every day from my students. If I didn't learn something I didn't believe I was doing my job. The auto industry working with the oil companies improved oil over the years. 10W-30 then 10W-40 was introduced then in the late 70's 80's and 90's they introduced 10W-20 and even 5W-30 and 20. Why?? Thinner oil gets to the bearings sooner and it is easier to spin the crankshaft thereby increasing the life of the engine and improving fuel mileage. The auto industry has not recommended 10W-40 oil since the mid 80's and yet many, many many, still use it. Why??? Because that's what they've always done and for no other good reason. Why do some still believe putting a car battery on a concrete floor will suck the energy out of it?? Because that's what their Dad told them. Here's the best of all my classroom stories. Why does the whole world still produce a girls bicycle with the center bar lowered???? Have you ever thought about it??? There is only one answer that makes sense. Bicycles first gained in popularity back in the 1890's when women wore skirts all the way to the ground. It was not Lady like to sling your leg over the bar so it was lowered to for the women. That is a tradition which began 110 plus years ago and it still persists today for no good reason. Technology has changed over the years but old traditions die very very hard. Mobil Oil was introduced back in the early 70's and they advertised 25,000 mile oil changes. I'm here to tell you that does work. There are companies out there who do put 50K plus miles on their engines using Mobil 1 and they only change the filter every 10K and keep the oil topped up. In the early 70's and even today that's just way to different from the established norm for the general public to even begin to accept that notion.
I hope you've enjoyed my stories and I mean no disrespect. My only intent is to try and inform so people make decisions based more on fact than on what has traditionally been done.
TeJay
I do understand why some do what they do and if one feels comfortable then that's OK. My only interest is to educate those that have to do repairs and maintenance so they don't do things that cost them $$$$ when it is not necessary. If possible I like to share what I learned and perhaps can direct others to use ideas, techniques, tools, lubricants etc. to accomplish better maintenance on their rigs. Remember that these are only my opinions but they are based on 35 years teaching and learning automotive service and repair. I learned every day from my students. If I didn't learn something I didn't believe I was doing my job. The auto industry working with the oil companies improved oil over the years. 10W-30 then 10W-40 was introduced then in the late 70's 80's and 90's they introduced 10W-20 and even 5W-30 and 20. Why?? Thinner oil gets to the bearings sooner and it is easier to spin the crankshaft thereby increasing the life of the engine and improving fuel mileage. The auto industry has not recommended 10W-40 oil since the mid 80's and yet many, many many, still use it. Why??? Because that's what they've always done and for no other good reason. Why do some still believe putting a car battery on a concrete floor will suck the energy out of it?? Because that's what their Dad told them. Here's the best of all my classroom stories. Why does the whole world still produce a girls bicycle with the center bar lowered???? Have you ever thought about it??? There is only one answer that makes sense. Bicycles first gained in popularity back in the 1890's when women wore skirts all the way to the ground. It was not Lady like to sling your leg over the bar so it was lowered to for the women. That is a tradition which began 110 plus years ago and it still persists today for no good reason. Technology has changed over the years but old traditions die very very hard. Mobil Oil was introduced back in the early 70's and they advertised 25,000 mile oil changes. I'm here to tell you that does work. There are companies out there who do put 50K plus miles on their engines using Mobil 1 and they only change the filter every 10K and keep the oil topped up. In the early 70's and even today that's just way to different from the established norm for the general public to even begin to accept that notion.
I hope you've enjoyed my stories and I mean no disrespect. My only intent is to try and inform so people make decisions based more on fact than on what has traditionally been done.
TeJay
Marge
All who wander are not lost.
A trailerite friend of ours told us he always used Bearing Buddies on his travel trailer.
Anybody else have any experience with using them ? Glen is now repacking the wheel bearings on our trailer, even though we don't have more than 4500 miles on it, but he hasn't looked at them since we got the trailer.
Any input would be appreciated.
Anybody else have any experience with using them ? Glen is now repacking the wheel bearings on our trailer, even though we don't have more than 4500 miles on it, but he hasn't looked at them since we got the trailer.
Any input would be appreciated.
JohnDar
Prolifically Gabby Member
TeJay, no offense was taken. I gave up being a shade tree mechanic years ago when I realized the newer vehicles required more tools and specialized equipment than I wanted to buy. Besides, laying on my driveway doing work is not a pleasurable experience.
In regards to what you said, there are still those that think changing their oil every 3000 miles is dogma. I analyzed enough oil samples to know that's nonsense. I now rely on the oil life indicators that the vehicles come with to determine when to change. Some of the work I did years ago was part of the ground work that preceded them.
I did learn the hard way what happens when you neglect the bearings on a trailer, though. Our boat trailer is mainly used to store the boat at the marina during the winter, so in 8 years, it never got serviced. The one time I had to pull the boat 8 miles, I lost a complete bearing set. Got all four replaced with Bearing Buddies so they get lubed periodically when the boat gets winterized.
Keep on educating!
In regards to what you said, there are still those that think changing their oil every 3000 miles is dogma. I analyzed enough oil samples to know that's nonsense. I now rely on the oil life indicators that the vehicles come with to determine when to change. Some of the work I did years ago was part of the ground work that preceded them.
I did learn the hard way what happens when you neglect the bearings on a trailer, though. Our boat trailer is mainly used to store the boat at the marina during the winter, so in 8 years, it never got serviced. The one time I had to pull the boat 8 miles, I lost a complete bearing set. Got all four replaced with Bearing Buddies so they get lubed periodically when the boat gets winterized.
Keep on educating!
If you don't want or need brakes the bearing buddies work well. Really designed for boat trailers to keep the water out of the bearings when submerged. We have them on the boat trailers for sure. They would not be the right choice for any trailer where you need the full breaking power at any given time.
SmokeyBare
Well-known member
Here is a video that might be helpful for some to view...
http://www.youtube.com/user/etrailertv?v=6k2T79nHXgw&feature=pyv&ad=5662828116&kw=wheel%20bearing%20repack
http://www.youtube.com/user/etrailertv?v=6k2T79nHXgw&feature=pyv&ad=5662828116&kw=wheel%20bearing%20repack
Marge
All who wander are not lost.
I'll pass that information on to Glen, thank you.
Sandpirate69
Well-known member
Tejay,
You are totally correct. I've been working on cars, Harleys, & trucks since I was a kid. I have read several of your posts on Re-Packing the wheel bearings. Ypu are on point. If you ever lubed a set via the zerk fitting on a a truck, it tends to come outward and then you will see a mess on your rims. If you have disk breaks, not so bad. But, if you have drum breaks like the majority of us, your rig will not stop properly. The oil topic, I run Mobil Super on my Duramax. I had the oil analyzed several times and I can run it close to about 15K miles before needing replacement. I do change the filter at 7.5K.. So like you said, Old Habits are Hard to change.
On another note, Happy Father's Day to All !!!!
You are totally correct. I've been working on cars, Harleys, & trucks since I was a kid. I have read several of your posts on Re-Packing the wheel bearings. Ypu are on point. If you ever lubed a set via the zerk fitting on a a truck, it tends to come outward and then you will see a mess on your rims. If you have disk breaks, not so bad. But, if you have drum breaks like the majority of us, your rig will not stop properly. The oil topic, I run Mobil Super on my Duramax. I had the oil analyzed several times and I can run it close to about 15K miles before needing replacement. I do change the filter at 7.5K.. So like you said, Old Habits are Hard to change.
On another note, Happy Father's Day to All !!!!
The you tube video is lacking just a little. I've never advocated using a hammer on a screw drive. The most important item that he forgot is what to do with the grease he wiped from the bearing. LOOK AT THE GREASE BEFORE YOU THROW THE RAG AWAY. IT HAS A LOT OF INFORMATION IN IT. Bearings fail because of heat build up from: a lack of lubrication, excessive load, to little bearing clearance or foreign matter entering the bearing area. The excessive heat will destroy the metals temper/hardness and it will begin to flake away. Long, long, long before you can hear a defective bearing or see pits in the rollers the metal will flake away and you can spot it in the grease. It will look like sparkles when you inspect the grease that you wipe away. That is a most crucial step to assist you in diagnosing defective bearings. If you see no sparkles the bearings are good. Just repack them and correctly adjust the clearance. Bearing buddies are a no, no, no. Remember what happens when you pack the hub full of grease. You reduce the heats ability to escape and heat is a major enemy of bearing failure.
John, thanks for the comments. I think some times I'm sharing what I've learned and it's falling on deaf ears. I guess people will take it or leave it and that's all I can do. Interesting work that you apparently were involved in your previous life. Can you enlighten us or me on what or how they determine when the oil is getting to the end of its life?? We've had several vehicles that had that capability but I was never sure if it really worked that well.
Thanks,TeJay
TeJay
John, thanks for the comments. I think some times I'm sharing what I've learned and it's falling on deaf ears. I guess people will take it or leave it and that's all I can do. Interesting work that you apparently were involved in your previous life. Can you enlighten us or me on what or how they determine when the oil is getting to the end of its life?? We've had several vehicles that had that capability but I was never sure if it really worked that well.
Thanks,TeJay
TeJay
Sandpirate69
Well-known member
I have that capability in my Duramax. I have taken it down to 50% and then sent it out for analysis. Every time it's come back with excellent numbers. I will try to look for one of the results document and post it. I change the diesel filter every 10K miles, regardless of what the information center says. So far knock on wood my truck purrs like a kitten & pulls like a mule.
JohnDar
Prolifically Gabby Member
TeJay, it's been many moons since I was in the lab, but we were investigating a problem with a new design engine. Once it got into production, problems started to develop with coolant leaking into the oil pan. So I ended up analyzing close to 2000 oil samples from fleet test cars for everything from wear metals, additive depletion, fuel dilution, water content, and a few other parameters. Around the same time, work was starting on oil life indicator technology and some of my results were added to the database.
Thanks guys for the advice and suggestions. The dealer recommendation of repack at the first 500 miles seemed out of line. We had a pop-up for 15 years and repacked the bearings twice (with a 12 year interval). The trailer trailer went 2 years and 5000 miles also with no problems. I think I'll check them annually, at least for the first couple of years.
hogan
Past Mississippi Chapter Leader (Founding)
I want to chime in on the comments. We did a "show and tell" demo at our recent Gulf Shores Rally and used my rig as the demo. I had around 8-10K on the coach and was about 1.5 years since new. We did not find bearing wear (all okay) but did find that grease had found it's way into three of the drums and had compromised the braking. I had not greased it since I purchased so we only could guess that either they had pumped too much grease at installation, PDI at the dealer, or three seals had failed in that length of use. I am much more confident now knowing my bearings are good and lubed properly and have working brakes. I intend to continue the one year intervals for service.
Our demonstration led many other attendees to do their bearing service after the rally. Several found problems that were very near causing a serious delaying failure. Bob Mansolino, who did the presentation made a very important point: Buy a complete bearing set including seal and carry in your rig. If you have a failure on the road, it's easy to find a shop that can replace the bearings, but it's not so easy to find the bearing set you need when you're out in the boonies.
Our demonstration led many other attendees to do their bearing service after the rally. Several found problems that were very near causing a serious delaying failure. Bob Mansolino, who did the presentation made a very important point: Buy a complete bearing set including seal and carry in your rig. If you have a failure on the road, it's easy to find a shop that can replace the bearings, but it's not so easy to find the bearing set you need when you're out in the boonies.
rick_debbie_gallant
Well-known member
I may have missed it somewhere in the thread. How does one find out which bearing set one needs? thank you.
hoganc,
Your point is well taken. It is my opinion that the system designed to allow easier lubrication of the trailer bearings is the real cause of all the failures. Eliminate the system and go back to correctly packing bearings and you solve the problems. Lets think about it and ask how could grease flow past the seal and onto the brake material.??? Any one of several things can caused it. You touched onto some of them. A system that allows grease to be pumped into and through an axle so the inner bearing can be lubricated is one of the causes. If you couldn't pump the grease in then it couldn't leak out. The viscosity of the lubrication that is used has to be thinner to travel through the small axle opening and into the bearings. That also means if to much lube is used it can also flow where it's not supposed to flow. The inner bearing is larger and is designed to bear the greatest amount of the load. It needs to be properly lubricated. The inner seal is probably not the best seal available and is therefore a weak link in the system. I just ordered new seals for my rig and a double lip seal is $8. About double a regular seal. I don't believe the manufacturer will spring for that kind of protection. I'll go back to what I've already said. Properly packing bearings with a good synthetic lube, installing good seals, and proper adjustment of the bearing clearance will eliminate any chance of any grease from ever getting to your brakes. It just won't happen. The higher viscosity synthetic bearing lubes won't flow unless they get really hot and that means that you've burned up some bearings. The bearings should last 30K-40K with no service necessary.
Rick,
I just removed my bearings to determine which bearings to order to replace the China bearings. There are numbers on the bearings and seals. Any good bearing supplier can cross that number and get you the stuff you need. As I said before. An industrial supply house can get you a good quality bearing and seal. I don't think you'll spend more than 100-150 bucks on all new good bearings and seals. If you can do it yourself just get the bearings and take is to a good service center and have them out those bearings on your rig. Ask for your old one and they can be used as a back up set if you get stranded. I did learn something this week. They will sometimes list two different races for the same bearing. I'm going to have to remove my races measure them to determine which race to order.
Tejay
Your point is well taken. It is my opinion that the system designed to allow easier lubrication of the trailer bearings is the real cause of all the failures. Eliminate the system and go back to correctly packing bearings and you solve the problems. Lets think about it and ask how could grease flow past the seal and onto the brake material.??? Any one of several things can caused it. You touched onto some of them. A system that allows grease to be pumped into and through an axle so the inner bearing can be lubricated is one of the causes. If you couldn't pump the grease in then it couldn't leak out. The viscosity of the lubrication that is used has to be thinner to travel through the small axle opening and into the bearings. That also means if to much lube is used it can also flow where it's not supposed to flow. The inner bearing is larger and is designed to bear the greatest amount of the load. It needs to be properly lubricated. The inner seal is probably not the best seal available and is therefore a weak link in the system. I just ordered new seals for my rig and a double lip seal is $8. About double a regular seal. I don't believe the manufacturer will spring for that kind of protection. I'll go back to what I've already said. Properly packing bearings with a good synthetic lube, installing good seals, and proper adjustment of the bearing clearance will eliminate any chance of any grease from ever getting to your brakes. It just won't happen. The higher viscosity synthetic bearing lubes won't flow unless they get really hot and that means that you've burned up some bearings. The bearings should last 30K-40K with no service necessary.
Rick,
I just removed my bearings to determine which bearings to order to replace the China bearings. There are numbers on the bearings and seals. Any good bearing supplier can cross that number and get you the stuff you need. As I said before. An industrial supply house can get you a good quality bearing and seal. I don't think you'll spend more than 100-150 bucks on all new good bearings and seals. If you can do it yourself just get the bearings and take is to a good service center and have them out those bearings on your rig. Ask for your old one and they can be used as a back up set if you get stranded. I did learn something this week. They will sometimes list two different races for the same bearing. I'm going to have to remove my races measure them to determine which race to order.
Tejay
