Why doesn't Heartland use Tankless Heater & Command Center Touch Screen
- Thread starter pavetim
- Start date
I think I can address this.
Tankless Water Heater
This item costs quite a bit more than a standard water heater. Would 100% of our buyers want a tankless water heater? Bear in mind that it runs only off propane. So no more using AC power to heat water. That said, like you, there are a number of buyers that want, need and would pay the extra cost for the tankless water heater. I believe we're beginning to consider this. The reason I say this is that I was asked if I would be interested in trying one out in my new demo coach. I said yes. I will pick this coach up mid-May and will give Heartland feedback after using it for a month or so. Perhaps if feedback is favorable, we'll consider offering it as an option. I can't speak for sales or manufacturing, but this is my hope. Note too that all RV tankless water heaters will fit in the same space as the standard water heater - so this is a simple, yet costly upgrade an owner could do or have done. And, a brand new, never used dual fuel water heater has a lot of resale value, so there would be some cost recovery there if a buyer could be found.
Command Center Touch Screen
The price point on multiplex lighting and control systems has been coming down as more players enter this space. Heartland has trialed 2 such systems and at this time, a system from KIB is standard on the Landmark product. Note that we have elected to not have a central control screen on a wall that controls the system. Rather, we took the approach to have "point of use" switches, with some of those switch panels having the ability to control up to 6 items. Like you want, it's my personal desire to eventually have a system that adds Smart Device (phones, tablets etc) control of the system "in addition to" point-of-use switches. In this manner, the person who only wants wall switches as before, still has them and the person who also wants Smart Device control, has that as well. I am not privy to whether Heartland has any plan to add Smart Device control. Nor to I know if/when a multiplex control system will find its way into other Heartland brands.
Thank you for your questions. Which Heartland product are you considering?
Tankless Water Heater
This item costs quite a bit more than a standard water heater. Would 100% of our buyers want a tankless water heater? Bear in mind that it runs only off propane. So no more using AC power to heat water. That said, like you, there are a number of buyers that want, need and would pay the extra cost for the tankless water heater. I believe we're beginning to consider this. The reason I say this is that I was asked if I would be interested in trying one out in my new demo coach. I said yes. I will pick this coach up mid-May and will give Heartland feedback after using it for a month or so. Perhaps if feedback is favorable, we'll consider offering it as an option. I can't speak for sales or manufacturing, but this is my hope. Note too that all RV tankless water heaters will fit in the same space as the standard water heater - so this is a simple, yet costly upgrade an owner could do or have done. And, a brand new, never used dual fuel water heater has a lot of resale value, so there would be some cost recovery there if a buyer could be found.
Command Center Touch Screen
The price point on multiplex lighting and control systems has been coming down as more players enter this space. Heartland has trialed 2 such systems and at this time, a system from KIB is standard on the Landmark product. Note that we have elected to not have a central control screen on a wall that controls the system. Rather, we took the approach to have "point of use" switches, with some of those switch panels having the ability to control up to 6 items. Like you want, it's my personal desire to eventually have a system that adds Smart Device (phones, tablets etc) control of the system "in addition to" point-of-use switches. In this manner, the person who only wants wall switches as before, still has them and the person who also wants Smart Device control, has that as well. I am not privy to whether Heartland has any plan to add Smart Device control. Nor to I know if/when a multiplex control system will find its way into other Heartland brands.
Thank you for your questions. Which Heartland product are you considering?
danemayer
Well-known member
Re: Why doesn't heartland use tankless heater
Hi pavetim,
I expect a tankless water heater would have to run on propane only, because a 15 or 20 amp electrical unit probably wouldn't be up to the job. I know a lot of us prefer to run our water heaters on electric to avoid schlepping heavy propane tanks around (my tanks weigh 72 lbs when full). So while some people may prefer tankless and don't mind managing the propane usage, I'd guess most of us would not want one. And given that they cost more than traditional water heaters, it wouldn't be a plus for me.
Hi pavetim,
I expect a tankless water heater would have to run on propane only, because a 15 or 20 amp electrical unit probably wouldn't be up to the job. I know a lot of us prefer to run our water heaters on electric to avoid schlepping heavy propane tanks around (my tanks weigh 72 lbs when full). So while some people may prefer tankless and don't mind managing the propane usage, I'd guess most of us would not want one. And given that they cost more than traditional water heaters, it wouldn't be a plus for me.
212Pilot
Active Member
We have been living in our cyclone now for 8 months and have yet to take a cold shower. When we ordered our cyclone I asked if we could order a tankless and was told they don't offer it. I am now very glad they didn't because of the expense and its not needed. When we have multiple people showering I turn on both electric and propane and it has a very fast recovery time like a tankless water heater. We have had 5 people take showers one after another and all got hot showers. The draw back to a tanked water heater is if you are running propane to keep it hot. When we boondock we only run the water heater when we need it for dishes or showers.
Ok good answers and I didn't know tankless systems were propane only, that sucks. And honestly I didn't know you could operate a standard water heater on both electric and propane to speed up the heating. Guess its that whole "rv" label that jacks the cost up too cause these systems for a home aren't expensive at all
travlingman
Well-known member
I have read that on tankless if you turn the water off to lather up, you have to wait for "X" amount of water to run thru the heater again to warm up. Since we use COE parks alot this would be a big negative considering the extra water incurred taking a shower. Does anyone know how much water it takes? Also, don't like that I have to use my propane instead of the electric I have paid for when renting the site.
TravelTiger
Founding Texas-West Chapter Leaders-Retired
I prefer not to use propane at all, if possible. I'd push for having Cheap Heat (electric heat add-on to current furnace) over a tankless water heater.
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I also did read propane is better for heat rise because on average the electric will raise the water temp 40-60 degrees above ground water. Now most cases that would be fine but if you are in cold climate and water is 40 degree then your taking a colder shower possibly. I though would love more R&D on these and make a dual fuel unit as these may eventually change the whole market. And they really aremt much more than standard heaters but you don't need anode rods, rinsing rods, risk rotting out, etc. But on a side not ichabe a cedar creek currently but looking to get a road warrior. I think the cedar creek has 10gal water heater and two of us showering right after each other has not run out of hot water yet.
danemayer
Well-known member
Yes, the Rheem RT 9 and others are electric tankless heaters. BUT, they require 240V. You could make that work in an RV if you always have a 50 amp power connection. A 30 amp receptacle wouldn't work.
It's the same problem with dryers in an RV. They take way longer to dry clothes than a residential unit because they're limited to 120V. A residential unit runs on 240V.
At a minimum it should be offered in the Landmark and Bighorn unit. It was the first thing I added to our Landmark, (changed out before the PDI). I added the Truma AquaGo. After 4 RV’s with the traditional electric/propane system its night and day with the Truma.
As far as the touch panel is concerned - can’t see Heartland doing it. Technology is just not in their culture. Even divisions within the parent company, (Thor), do a better job with available technology.
As far as the touch panel is concerned - can’t see Heartland doing it. Technology is just not in their culture. Even divisions within the parent company, (Thor), do a better job with available technology.
BigGuy82
Well-known member
Now, this is just my opinion and preference, so don't take any offense.
Personally, I'd rather see disc brakes standard - as in "something that may save my life" - fancy control centers add nothing to the RV experience (just another high tech gewgaw) and I can't say that our water heater doesn't do the job. If you need more hot water, run it on 120 and propane. I do think they should make this stuff optional to cater to customer preference, but a tankless water heater wouldn't entice me to buy any particular coach.
Why disc brakes aren't standard on every large RV on the road is a mystery to me. I just shelled out $1,800 for a disc brake upgrade kit and I did it with a smile. Anything that can stop me in 30-50% less distance is worth it. The best part is, I'll still have plenty of hot water ...
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Nabo
Southeast Region Director-Retired
As far as having a command center touchscreen, yes it would be nice but not a deal breaker. Tankless water heater or also known as on demand hot water heater would be no for us. We have changed out many things on our camper to get away from propane usage such as the furnace to cook top. Propane lines are one of the major case of camper fires behind propane refrigerators. Tankless water heaters use a huge amount of propane to heat the water, plus it takes a little longer to get the hot water to the faucets. We have tankless water heater at home and it takes forever to get hot water to the location that i need it.
Nuclearcowboy
Well-known member
Jim,
Thanks for the info. Our 2016 BH 3270RD came with a remote about the size of the older iPhone that controlled the awning, slides, and exterior lighting. Didn't think too much about it until after purchasing our 2017 BH 3970RD, which had no remote control at all. I wonder why? Was this being tested in 2016?
No offense taken I was just stating a couple things that pretty much every other manufacture has and offers. But YES to the disc brakes, I honestly don't like the magnetic brake setup. I have never looked, but i'm assuming thats what is there right? But if i set my brake controller on level 10 and hit the swtich you can really feel it slow down the truck, i would love to feel what disc brakes feel like.
I am technology guy. One thing I did not want when buying my new Fiver was a central control system. I have seen many failures in SOB with these systems, they have a panel of backup switches in the storage bay in case of failure. As far as tank-less no go. I have heard first hand from poeple that had the lesser quality units have them removed due to improper operation. Disc Brakes for FT use, for us non snowbirds in the Great White North have drum brakes is just fine.
Hi Nick and Dallas - LM, BH and BC all came with remotes for a number of years. As I understand it, feedback Heartland received from dealers is the usage of the remote vs the cost it added to the RV was under-appreciated. Not by everyone of course but apparently the feedback was that many of the features on it saw little use.
Personally, I only used my remote for raising and lower the front jacks from inside the truck. A time or two over the years, I used the remote to run out a slide while I was outside watching.
That said, I know some people use their remotes often. But for now, it's not on the product plan to re-add. Andy and the entire Heartland team are real busy with month end this week but he'll try to jump on this thread maybe next week to add his insight.
JohnDar
Prolifically Gabby Member
Would not having a touch screen command center that can be accessed from a Smartphone or iPad require a dedicated (aka. reliable) WiFi or internet connection. Just speaking from experience with our home HVAC system, if the internet isn't accessible, neither is the connection to the home system (other than through the thermostats on the wall).
I like the old fashioned switches in our rig. No need to log onto anything to turn off a light.
I like the old fashioned switches in our rig. No need to log onto anything to turn off a light.
Nope - Bluetooth. 30 -100 foot radius. All smart phones have BT.
BigGuy82
Well-known member
We average about 8,000 - 10,000 miles/year - discs come in handy for going down a steep grade (eliminate rig pushing and rig brake fade), preserving truck braking power in an adverse high-heat situation (steep grades or endless miles of caterpillar traffic) and lessening general wear on truck brakes - not to mention the extra stopping power in emergencies. Drums are certainly OK but discs are far safer in any situation - reams of data support this. I have discs on all of my vehicles and they all have ABS also (including my motorcycle). I just wish someone could figure out how to incorporate ABS into trailer braking systems.
I think manufacturers should offer things like control panels, advanced suspension systems, tankless water heaters, etc., etc. as options - I'm a firm believer in giving the customer as much of what they want to pay for as possible. I still think that safety related items like disc brakes should be standard and if all coaches came that way out of the factory, the cost would likely be minimal with a big gain in safety. There are very few cars and trucks today that don't come with discs and they all come with seat belts. We are all safer for it.
We generally carry our remote in whatever vehicle we are driving the most. If we return to our rig and find that it is raining, we'll run the awning out remotely to minimize the distance we have to dash in the rain (especially if carrying groceries or other items). That said, we typically only use it otherwise for the occasional front jack or slide movement as you've mentioned.
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