"Legal Towing"

[JJOren]

I was reading another thread this morning about towing capacities and the statement was made "In order to be legal you must be within the manufacturers tow ratings". I didn't want to hijack the thread but I would like to understand this better and I thought I would post it here.

I understand the concept of safety and being within spec to be safe. I also understand the concept of manufacturers specs, the potential of voiding warranties by being over weight etc. But using the word "legal" implies there are states out there that have statutory requirements on tow ratings. Is that accurate? If so, how is it enforced? Weigh Station? Mobile DOT scales? Random traffic stops? What is required for proof of violation? What 'specs' are used for determination?

Not disputing anything but so far, I've towed in 31 states and have yet to even be required to stop at a weigh station. If there are states out there with statutory requirements for RV's I think I need to at least be aware of them.

 

[Rickhansen]

JJ,
Can't answer your question, but here's a good summary. http://www.towingworld.com/articles/TowingLaws.htm

I notice that many states refer to manufacturers ratings. That could be inclusive of your tow vehicle, trailer, axles, tires, etc. and I assume these laws are enforceable. I imagine that a law enforcement officer could utilize a portable scale or require you to go to a weigh station. I suspect that for non-commercial vehicles it is seldom checked, but in the case of an accident, you could face legal issues and denial of insurance claims, etc. if you were proven negligent of the laws or ratings.

 

[JohnDar]

If I recall correctly, "legality" is determined by the state your vehicle and driver's licenses are issued by. Should you be involved in a mishap and it's found you exceed your state regulations, your goose might be cooked. Just like some states require special indorsements on your driver's license to pull a trailer, they can't mandate it on non-residents passing through.

 

[navyAZ1]

I agree, I would think these things only come into play in the event of an accident. That's why I went to a heavier truck, when I had our rig weighed the first time the only problem noted was that my pin weight was over by 300 lbs, the guy doing the weighing stated that this was due to GM stating that my rear axle on my (at the time) truck was 8,700 lbs, but he stated that they don't make an axle that size that it is the attorney's at GM that are saying the 9,600 lb axle that is on the truck is only rated to 8,700 lbs. So, technically I was probably safe towing with my 2500HD, but legally NO! So, I upgraded to avoid some legal eagle coming after me in the event of an accident, stating that I was negligent due to my knowingly towing over weight.

 

[SJH]

Should you be involved in a mishap and it's found you exceed your state regulations, your goose might be cooked.

I think this is a key statement. In many situations the issues only come to light when there is an incident investigation. If someone is involved in an accident, weight and equipment stats become much more important to LEO and insurance companies. As a pilot, I can't remember one time being "ramp checked" for currency or medical certifiate but I have seen it done to others for one or another type of infraction.

 

[Nabo]

I've been using the guide published by Trailer Life Directory and they are pretty much the same as Towing World.

 

[jmgratz]

As for the legality of the weights I can tell you this. At least in Texas LE officers have the right to stop you with Probable Cause (legal definition) and check your weights. The sticker on the door of your vehicle and the sticker on the trailer have the maximum allowable weights. The LEO can weigh you using portable scales and has a right to make you park the vehicle on the spot if you are in violation and cite you for that violation. What might be used as Probable Cause...how about a tow vehicle that is squatting obviously being overloaded. As a practical matter LEO are overworked enforcing Commercial vehicle laws to a point RVers are seldom stopped. But we all know if you are towing a Big Horn with an F150 1/2 ton truck that would be obviously overloaded and a serious safety hazard. Now, if you are involved in an accident the LEO will look at all of the contributing factors for the accident including licensing, inspections, weight and traffic law violations (such as speeding, following to close etc.). Hope this clears it up for you.

 

[westxsrt10]

I can see your concern with the legal towing laws with your set-up.
How much overweight are you?

 

[ncrebel8]

You need to check the regulations in the state your rig is registerd in, and you are licensed in. Also while checking those laws make sure you read the "recreational vehicle exemptions".

 

[JJOren]

I can see your concern with the legal towing laws with your set-up.
How much overweight are you?

Actually, I'm not....the GVWR on the MESA is 16,400. Based on the 2002 Chevrolet specs, my towing limit with the 8.1, Allison and a 410 rear end is 16,400. GVWR on the truck is 9200 with a curb weight of 5126. Payload = 4074. Pin weight on the MESA is 2650. This particular set up on the HD is quite a horse.

Having said all that we have been looking at doing an upgrade. Don't like running that close to the limits.

 

[caissiel]

My truck is registered to 12000 lbs. My friends 2000 and 2004 F350s are registered for 11600lbs. So in registration spec in my province the 2005s are capable to carry total weight much higher then previous years. My door label by Ford is 10klbs. So because I am licenced for 12k I can be legaly loaded to 12k. Its up to me to drive according to the load I have on my truck. I am licenced to 26k gcvw so having the F250 gives me an advantage with the gcvw due to the lighter weight of my truck.
My previous 6.5 GM was rated to 8600lbs and trailer gvw of 8500lbs, the 8.1 gas was rated to 11600lbs with the diesel having all the equipment similar as the 8.1 except for the motor. I pulled a 11600lbs trailer for 9 years.
So to me a heavy truck does help but some lighter trucks do travel much faster then I do and only put others in danger even if they are legaly registered or rated properly. Its the driver that makes the diference as I can see 40ft motorhome driven at 80mph with car licence qualifications.

PS anyone has registered gross vehicle weights for your truck. I know most Canadian Provinces have it on the registration, and is different from truck models. Its usualy a percentage of the dry weight of the truck. I tried to lower mine to save on licensing and cannot while my friends did.

 

[Boca_Shuffles]

JJOren,

Have you ever weighed your truck? You mentioned "curb weight". Is this from a brochure?

I had a 2006 GMC Duramax that weighed about 600 lbs over the weight in the brochure. It must have been in the center console, back bumper and who knows what else was optional. I never figured out where the extra weight.

I was extremely annoyed with the dealer because I tried to use their documentation and it was incorrect.

My 2006 weighed 7200 lbs with myself, a Reese 16K hitch and a standard tank of fuel.

With my empty SOB with a 2000 pin weight attached, I was at 9200 lbs, the GVWR of the truck. Adding clothes to the RV, food, DW, and two dogs put me over.

We traded up to a HD3500 and a Bighorn.

So if you haven't weighed your truck, you might be surprised.

.

 

[branson4020]

Actually, I'm not....the GVWR on the MESA is 16,400. Based on the 2002 Chevrolet specs, my towing limit with the 8.1, Allison and a 410 rear end is 16,400. GVWR on the truck is 9200 with a curb weight of 5126. Payload = 4074. Pin weight on the MESA is 2650. This particular set up on the HD is quite a horse.

Having said all that we have been looking at doing an upgrade. Don't like running that close to the limits.

That is an astonishing payload number. Have you actually weighed your truck?

 

[caissiel]

my 98 2500 was dry weight off only 5400 and gross weight of 8600 lbs but it was with the diesel engine. Older GM's are light trucks compared to the Fords and can carry more weight. Same 1990 1500 diesel model, weight only 4300 lbs and the weight differences was in the frame as I did noticed the hard time I had to drill for the 5th wheel hitch install.

 

[westxsrt10]

That is an astonishing payload number. Have you actually weighed your truck?

Thats odd.......his payload is double my 2008 F-250's?

 

[caissiel]

Possible with a 2wd single cab as mine was a 4x4 club. Mine was rated for 3200lbs load and my f250 is only 2200lbs no more then 1/2 tons use to carry.

 

[JJOren]

Yes, actually I have.....the actual weight on the 2500 HD is 5050 empty. At this point isn't really pertinent to much of anything. This whole thread was related to 'legal' towing.

I traded the 2500 HD today on a new F-350 DRW. Pick it up Friday. At the same time, the older F-250's and 2500 HD's have long been underestimated in comparison to current line.

 

[DW_Gray]

Regardless of what state you are licensed in and your vehicles are registered in, you still have to abide by the laws of the state you are driving in. Example: Truckers cannot tow more than one trailer in California nor can an RVer tow a fifth wheel RV with a boat towed behind the fifth wheel. It's okay tow double trailer in some states, but not in California.

As I've said before, I was told by CHP that they will only stop an RVer if there is an "appearance" of something wrong. Just about any day of the week, you'll see overloaded RVs (toy haulers) on the sands of Pismo Beach, CA.

 

[MaryandSteve]

Here is a link to LEGAL TOWING in California. Recreational Vehicles and Trailers Handbook Bye the way it is legal for a Semi to tow two trailers.(look at FedEx,UPS,YRC,and AFB)

 

[westxsrt10]

Yes, actually I have.....the actual weight on the 2500 HD is 5050 empty. At this point isn't really pertinent to much of anything. This whole thread was related to 'legal' towing.

I traded the 2500 HD today on a new F-350 DRW. Pick it up Friday. At the same time, the older F-250's and 2500 HD's have long been underestimated in comparison to current line.

Thats great news! You will enjoy your new F-350 DRW without a doubt.