Living in Heartland Rig in the Wintertime

[icechex]

Didn't plan on being this far north (Oklahoma City, Ok) but we are stuck here till after the holidays due to family illness, so I'm concerned with making it thru 'freezing temps' in our Big Country (2012/3690SL).

I'm aware of making sure the outside water hose is 'heated' to keep from freezing it up (the water supply is protected by the RV Park) - but need a little help in what (if any) precautions I need to take concerning the tanks, (black, gray(2), and fresh water).

I'm assuming (and we all know where that gets you sometimes) - that I should drain my "fresh water tank" and leave the drain valve "Open."

The "black tank" should be kept as empty as possible and left "closed."

Both my "gray tanks" should be as empty as possible and left "opened."

Water should be left on (to a dribble) and inside sinks/drains should be 'free and clear' so as to prevent flooding.

We would appreciate any advice/insight.

Thanks

D.

 

[danemayer]

Weatherspark.com history shows temps in Oklahoma City dropping below freezing in November and as low as 17 degrees F in December. Historic lows in December have been in the single digits. So you're subject to a pretty hard freeze.

You're exposed to freezing lots of things and causing lots of damage that could result in leaks that cause further damage. If you're at a campground where there are good shower and bath facilities, you might think about winterizing the unit and just not using any of the plumbing. If that's out of the picture, I'd make a couple of suggestions:

1. Run the furnace a lot to pump heat into the underbelly. Set the thermostat a little higher than you might otherwise. You might want to rent a 100# or larger external propane tank to avoid having to refill tanks every three days.
2. Get a 100-150 W heat lamp and put it behind the basement wall, over the water pump and associated plumbing. Make sure it's secure and won't fall down or come into contact with the floor or anything flammable.
3. Put a 60W droplight in the UDC to keep that area warm.
4. Instead of a regular flexible sewer hose, get a 3" pvc pipe and use heat tape and insulation. You'll need to shop Home Depot for stuff to adapt it to fit. A heated PVC pipe won't freeze or have a water dam build up, so you can leave the gray tanks open, which should avoid freeze damage to them.
5. To protect the black tank, I'd suggest watching the weather forecast closely. When a hard freeze is forecast, dump the tank ahead of it. If possible, leave it empty and don't use the toilet until the next morning. If not, after dumping, put a few gallons of water in the tank so you don't built up solids, and add a 1/2 gallon of RV antifreeze to help keep it from freezing.
6. Drain the fresh tank. It's pretty far away from the heat duct that feeds the underbelly, and I think the BC may have only a radiant barrier underneath, without any other insulation. Without a tank heater, you're exposed to damage.
7. If you have an icemaker, you need to evacuate all the water from the feed line, the solenoid, and the line from the solenoid into the freezer. Same with water dispenser if you have that.

The basement heat lamp, UDC droplight, and furnace heat ought to protect the black tank flush and outside shower lines.

I don't like the idea of leaving faucets trickling. If something goes wrong, you'll end up with a flood in the RV. If you follow the steps above, I wouldn't expect the pex lines to bathroom or kitchen to freeze. If they do, they should be ok as the temps come back up.

 

[icechex]

Fantastic, concise, and needed advice. Many Thanks!

 

[Mea_Dow]

Some friends of ours from NY wrapped their water hose in a pool noodle that they split open since it was hard to locate some cold weather items, here in Texas.

I have also heard about putting hay bales around the bottom of the rv to retain heat, obviously away from heat sources.

 

[caissiel]

We get our RV exposed to cold weather every fall befoer heading south.
1. I fill my water tank and disconnect all hoses and only fill again during the warm days.
2. We let the black water tank fill, the content in the tank will create it own heat and has never frozen on me even in middle of winter. There will be a warm day to dump.
3. The gray tanks, I pour a little bit of winshield washer or antifreeze when empty, to protect the valves from freezing and let them fill, They also have never frozen on me. If kept connected you will need good drain lines installed.
4. With single glazed windows, I placed 1in foam in the windows behind the curtains prevents condensations on the windows and helps in heating. In deep winter survival skirting wound be required.
5. The water tank drain use to freeze so I placed it under the corpplast panel, so the furnace keeps it warm.
6. We do have double pane windows and many times the temperature falls way below freezing and we stay warm using the Fireplace and furnace

 

[icechex]

Some friends of ours from NY wrapped their water hose in a pool noodle that they split open since it was hard to locate some cold weather items, here in Texas.

I have also heard about putting hay bales around the bottom of the rv to retain heat, obviously away from heat sources.

Thanks so much for your advice. My father-in-law confirmed your advice about the hay bales - he told me they work quite well.

Thanks again,

D

 

[icechex]

Your suggestions are very much appreciated as is your history of a) your black tank never freezing and b) pouring a little anti-freeze in the gray tanks (good idea).

Thanks, much

D

 

[icechex]

Dan

I was wondering if there is an 'easy' way to make sure the icemaker, solenoid/water lines don't freeze. It is supposed to get down to 29 degrees tonight and tomorrow night (here in OKC), and I will be taking a look at the Refer to see if I can figure out how to clear the solenoid and water lines. I'm just wondering if you've ever done this and maybe have a procedure I could follow.

Thanks,

D

 

[danemayer]

Dan

I was wondering if there is an 'easy' way to make sure the icemaker, solenoid/water lines don't freeze. It is supposed to get down to 29 degrees tonight and tomorrow night (here in OKC), and I will be taking a look at the Refer to see if I can figure out how to clear the solenoid and water lines. I'm just wondering if you've ever done this and maybe have a procedure I could follow.

Thanks,

D

There's a procedure in the refrigerator manual. If you can't find your hardcopy, you can download a copy of the Dometic 1350 manual here.

I should also mention that there's an article with step-by-step instructions and pictures in the current Owners Club Newsletter (a benefit of joining the Heartland Owners Club).

The short version is to apply 20psi of compressed air at the city water connection.
If you have a water dispenser, operate it to evacuate the water from the feed line to the solenoid, through that half of the solenoid, and to the water dispenser.

If no dispenser, disconnect the feed line on top of the solenoid (backside of refrigerator). The compressed air will blow the water out of that line.

Disconnect the water outlet connection on the bottom of the solenoid and drain the water that goes up to the icemaker.

Reconnect both connectors and let the compressed air continue applying pressure. Run several icemaker cycles to blow the water out of the icemaker side of the solenoid. To do this, lower the icemaker bail arm and remove the cover from the left side of the icemaker. Use a small screwdriver to start the ice-making cycle by turning the small gear counter-clockwise slightly. The gears should start turning, which will operate the solenoid and allow air to blow through the system, evacuating any remaining water. Run several cycles this way.

Close the icemaker feed line cutoff valve. It's usually found in the basement, behind the UDC, where the 1/4" clear icemaker feed line tees into the 1/2" pex line. On some models, it may be in other locations - maybe under the sink, maybe under the fridge.

 

[rjr6150]

Agree with other posters on the hay bale idea for insulation. With one caveat the bales are also very nice condos for the same little critters you're wanting to keep out. Found this out many years ago when we had a mobile home on our lake property.

 

[icechex]

Dan

Many thanks for your follow-up comment; "Amazing" (to me) that I didn't think of looking in the book. Duh? Anyway, your instructions are spot-on and very much appreciated. I do have the book and will take a look at it.

One, possibly dumb question though; Since the temp will only get to 29-30 degrees (not a hard freeze) I'm wondering if I should even go to the trouble to protect the icemaker/waterlines? It's been my experience that a 'slight/soft freeze' like what we have coming in the next two days "might not" justify the precautions we've been talking about.

Your opinion/thoughts.

thanks alot for your help

D

 

[icechex]

UPDATE: Dan - thanks for telling me to look at my Refrigerator Manual. Below is straight from my book.

"The icemaker is fully automatic and will operate in ambient temperatures as low as 0 degrees F. To allow operation at temperatures between 0-32 degrees F., the ice maker has a heater on the solenoid water valve and on the water line between the solenoid valve and ice maker."

Note: The manual does add as a "Caution" - that the water line heater 'does not' protect the water supply line from the vehicle shut off valve to the solenoid valve on the back of the refrigerator. "However," I'm assuming that this water line will be protected in the underbelly of the RV itself.

 

[danemayer]

The solenoid and line to the ice tray are probably wrapped with a heating line, so you MAY be ok there. The water feed line to the solenoid is another matter. The plastic is not very strong, and may be exposed directly to outside air. At 29 degrees, you could end up with leaks - some of which could put water into the basement or underbelly. So at a minimum, you should drain the feed line to the solenoid and close the cutoff.

Also, keep in mind that weather forecasts are imperfect and actual temps will vary for any particular spot. 29 at an airport weather station could turn into 25 in the same general area.

 

[icechex]

Dan

Just came back from inspecting the water line to the solenoid valve. I was somewhat 'surprised' to find the water line 'is not' exposed to outside air, and.... is wrapped in black insulation. Evidently, this is a 'fix' that Heartland has done pertaining to BC or the 2012 models. I'm knocking on wood - but .... I'm impressed.

 

[TravelTiger]

UPDATE: Dan - thanks for telling me to look at my Refrigerator Manual. Below is straight from my book.

"The icemaker is fully automatic and will operate in ambient temperatures as low as 0 degrees F. To allow operation at temperatures between 0-32 degrees F., the ice maker has a heater on the solenoid water valve and on the water line between the solenoid valve and ice maker."

Note: The manual does add as a "Caution" - that the water line heater 'does not' protect the water supply line from the vehicle shut off valve to the solenoid valve on the back of the refrigerator. "However," I'm assuming that this water line will be protected in the underbelly of the RV itself.

Is your fridge a dometic, or Norcold?

I saw this the other day...

Norcold is now producing cold weather kits that allow RV refrigerators to operate in temperatures as low as zero degrees Fahrenheit.

Beginning Oct. 1, factory-installed cold weather kits are standard on Norcold's N641.3 refrigerator models and the N841.3 gas absorption models. SKU numbers will not change with the new addition, according to Norcold.
A cold weather kit (Product No. 634913) also is available separately to the aftermarket to retrofit Norcold’s 6-, 8-, 10-, 12- and 17-cubic-foot refrigerators.


Now granted, it doesn't say ice makers!!

 

[Hastey]

icechex, I'm not at home right now, but several other of the Oklahoma Chapter members are in and around the OKC area. You need anything I'm sure they would be more than happy to help.

The good news is that it will get cold at night but we don't sustain freezing temps normally this time of year that will freeze large masses of water (holding tanks, etc). Just take care of your outside lines and everything should be good. DW and I are in South Louisiana now and will be heading back to Oklahoma on November 6th, going to the Oklahoma HOC fall rally South of OKC @ Thackerville. If I can help with anything P.M. me and I'll get you in touch with some of our members that are at home now.

 

[Hastey]

Is your fridge a dometic, or Norcold?

I saw this the other day...

Norcold is now producing cold weather kits that allow RV refrigerators to operate in temperatures as low as zero degrees Fahrenheit.



Beginning Oct. 1, factory-installed cold weather kits are standard on Norcold's N641.3 refrigerator models and the N841.3 gas absorption models. SKU numbers will not change with the new addition, according to Norcold.
A cold weather kit (Product No. 634913) also is available separately to the aftermarket to retrofit Norcold’s 6-, 8-, 10-, 12- and 17-cubic-foot refrigerators.


Now granted, it doesn't say ice makers!!

I just posted them a message asking if it did cover the ice maker. Hopefully they will get back with me.

 

[danemayer]

Dan

Just came back from inspecting the water line to the solenoid valve. I was somewhat 'surprised' to find the water line 'is not' exposed to outside air, and.... is wrapped in black insulation. Evidently, this is a 'fix' that Heartland has done pertaining to BC or the 2012 models. I'm knocking on wood - but .... I'm impressed.

My output line from the solenoid is wrapped in black insulation but the input line is not. Sounds like an improvement.

 

[icechex]

Rex

Yes - my refrigerator is a Norcold and as stated above (see other comments from me) the manual clearly describes it as being capable of operating in temps between 0-32 degrees F. The manual indicates (however) that the line coming into the solenoid 'may not' be protected i.e. exposed to outside weather or not insulated. However, my incoming line is enclosed within the trailer and 'is wrapped' in insulation. I'm assuming this is an improvement related to the BC or the 2012 models. In any event - I'm impressed with Heartland.

BTW, my last name is Hasty too....without the 'E' though.

Thanks for your comment - it is appreciated.

D. Hasty

 

[icechex]

Dan

Sounds like an improvement - or someone (at Heartland) going the extra mile. In any event - I'm happy about it.

Thanks so much - for all your help/assistance.

D.