New Member

[rcharrette]

Hi all, I just joined this forum as we are months away from our purchase of a Gateway 3800RLB. We are a family of 4 (Myself, Wife, 11 and 2yr old boys). We've had a 27'TT for the past 3 years, 1/2 timing for 2 of those years and then full time traveling in it for the past year. We've decided we like this lifestyle and we need a bit more room! Currently we pull our Kodiak 240BHSL with a 08' Land Rover LR3, of course all this is going away and we now need a BIG pick up truck. So here I am starting to get educated on trucks and some background info on the unit we are interested in. I'll poke around the site and lurk here for a while then hit you all with some questions as the purchase day approaches.
Thanks,
Randy Charrette
pedaladventures.com

 

[danemayer]

Hi rcharrette,

Welcome to the Heartland Owners Forum. As you've seen, there's a lot of useful information here along with a great bunch of friendly and helpful people.

As you consider trucks, you may want to also visit Fifth Wheel Safe Towing to get a good understanding of how much truck you need. And you may want some excess towing/payload capacity so you don't need to trade up on trucks if you later trade up on RVs.

 

['Lil Guy']

Welcome to the forum. I've found the Heartland Forum and the HOC to be two of the biggest selling factors for HL. Like Dan has stated, great people and info on this site. I don't want to get into the truck issue but more is better(and safer). Keep us posted as to your new future purchase so we can welcome you to the family. Feel free to ask any questions about your future purchase and I'm sure you'll get some very knowledgeable answers here. Again, welcome to the forum.

 

[JohnD]

Welcome to the forum and maybe the Colorado Heartland Owner's Club!

 

[rcharrette]

Thanks for the welcome everyone. A question about the truck. We are looking at both Dodge Ram with the Cummings diesel as well as Ford.. I've not been able to get a reliable weight on the GW3800RLB but I did find 14000LBS on one site. I asumed we'd need a 3500HD or F350 but in researching the Dodge I've discovered the 2500 and 3500 are the exact same truck except for one extra leaf in the spring pack which increases payload capacity by about 500LBS.
My question is assuming the 5th wheel weight is 14K LBS ( it's a 42ft 5th wheel) do most people run airbags or can the stock suspension handle it?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[danemayer]

Randy,

New F350s or RAM 3500s (or GM/Chevy 3500s) will all have plenty of 5th wheel towing capacity to pull a Gateway 3800RLB. The Heartland website puts the GVWR at 13,800 TBD lbs. When loaded up, you'll probably be close to GVWR.

For payload, you have to consider not only the pin weight of the trailer, but also weight of the hitch, bed liner, bed cover, firewood, tools, pets, passengers, and anything else in the truck. For planning purposes, you might assume that pin weight is about 20% of the trailer GVWR, or 2,760 TBD. Add to that about 1,000 lbs to cover all the rest of the stuff in the truck.

So you'll want a truck with payload of at least 3,760TBD. Air bags will help keep the truck level if you're over the payload spec, but won't keep the weight balance of the truck, which could affect handling in bad weather or in emergency situations. Airbags also won't prevent excess wear on the truck.

Also, consider that while 20% of trailer GVWR is a fair planning number, the actual range people see is 15-25%. So your actual pin weight could be 700 lbs higher.

And a few years from now, if you trade up to a larger/heavier trailer, you'll find it handy to have spare payload capacity.

It's not hard to find a new F350 SRW truck with payload around 4,000 lbs or a bit higher. RAM 3500s can be a little harder to find, but are also available. And if you can go to a dually, you'll have way more payload.

 

[rcharrette]

Thanks for explaining! What about short bed VS long bed? I've heard some say with a short bed the trailer could hit the cab of the truck. Is this true? I think we'd prefer short bed but not if it's going to be a problem


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[danemayer]

Thanks for explaining! What about short bed VS long bed? I've heard some say with a short bed the trailer could hit the cab of the truck. Is this true? I think we'd prefer short bed but not if it's going to be a problem


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Heartland front caps are designed to allow 88 degree turns with short bed trucks. But it's pretty close. And not all trucks are exactly the same distance from back of the cab, to the rear axle. On a short bed, it's critical to have the hitch mounted correctly. If it's mounted a little too far forward - bang! On new trucks using pucks/frame, that shouldn't be a problem though.

Stability is important while towing a long, heavy trailer. A long bed is likely more stable.

Btw, when checking payload, don't go just by the brochures. They're just a starting point. There's a label on the drivers side door frame that shows the max load capacity of the truck you're about to buy. Often because of the way the truck is configured, the payload is quite a bit lower than the brochure number.

 

[cookie]

I currently have a long bed RAM, but I used to have a short bed GMC and towed two Bighorns with no problems on tight turns.
Heartland has an advertised 88° turn radius with their front cap design. It works.

Peace
Dave

 

[rcharrette]

Ok thanks. Does the dealer where you purchase the trailer usually provide and install the hitch in the bed? With our TT they included the hitch and sway bar with the purchase and installed it all while we were doing paperwork.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[SNOKING]

GVWR TBD
Dry Weight

13,800 lbs​

Hitch Weight

2,730 lbs​

Width

8' 0"​

Height

13' 3"​

Length

42' 2"​

Sq. Ft.

TBD​

Tires

ST235/80R16-E​

Fresh Water

57 gal​

Gray Water

80 gal​

Black Water

80 gal​

Electric

50 AMP​

LP Capacity

(2) 30 lbs​

Sleep Capacity

3-4 People​

No. of Slide Rooms

5 Slides​

At 13800 dry weight, if they give it a 16,000 GVWR then CCC will only be 2,200 pounds which is pretty low for a trailer this size. The dry pin of 2730 is going to put you into dually arena when loaded. It will need better tires than note above which came right off Heartland's site.

The other Gateways have 15,500 GVWR, so I would watch these numbers very closely.

Our BH3575el has a 16K GVWR as the models go up in size and weight they retain the same 16K GVWR and loose CCC.

Coming down to Arizona for the winter and trying to limit what we loaded a bit, we used up just about all of our 3K CCC. Filling the water heater and water tank takes up 550 pounds of CCC on the Gateway and 625 on my trailer. Don't fill the water tank behind the axles and your have more pin weight to deal with.

Chris

 

[SNOKING]

Thanks for the welcome everyone. A question about the truck. We are looking at both Dodge Ram with the Cummings diesel as well as Ford.. I've not been able to get a reliable weight on the GW3800RLB but I did find 14000LBS on one site. I asumed we'd need a 3500HD or F350 but in researching the Dodge I've discovered the 2500 and 3500 are the exact same truck except for one extra leaf in the spring pack which increases payload capacity by about 500LBS.
My question is assuming the 5th wheel weight is 14K LBS ( it's a 42ft 5th wheel) do most people run airbags or can the stock suspension handle it?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

As noted in my other post, this is not a trailer that is going to work with a single rear wheel truck, particularly with one built before 2011 or so, or any one still using 17" rims and tires which have lower ratings. We are pushing the limits of our 2015 RAM that has a 11,700 GVWR and 7K Rear GAWR. And that is not with anyone in the back seat of the truck. Everything that goes into the tow vehicle including passengers beyond the driver have to be factored into the overall weigth. Hitch, firewood, tools, etc etc. Get a dually(new one) answers that issue with this size trailer, and watch your numbers for the truck is not as big a deal. Trailer weight and CCC on this model are a big deal. the ST235/80R16E tires are a limiting issue, and if they stay with those vs load range G tires and the 15,500 GVWR, then the CCC is REALLY low. Chris

 

[rcharrette]

Thank you SNOKING. What is "CCC"?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[danemayer]

Sorry, I misread the Heartland website. Chris is correct, the dry weight is 13,800. GVWR is TBD and will probably come in close around 15,500 to 16,000 lbs. You might find an SRW that just barely covers the towing and payload, but you'll be right on the edge or over. Better off with a dually.

 

[SNOKING]

Thank you SNOKING. What is "CCC"?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Cargo carrying capacity.

Being a bunkhouse type trailer, I assume you have more that two people, this all has to be factored into tow vehicle weight. Chris

 

[JohnD]

Ok thanks. Does the dealer where you purchase the trailer usually provide and install the hitch in the bed?

Yes, but I would maybe have it double checked by a good trailer hitch shop (there is one here in Denver that we used for our two previous bumper pull TT's).

Our dealership included a 5th-wheel hitch (a slider for a short box truck is a good thing to have even if you never have to use it) . . .

However, after a year and a half and roughly 5000 miles it has come to our attention that we've been towing about 4 1/2 inches too high in the front which now looks like we will have to replace the rear axle (and all of the tires) because of this.

I wish I had taken our truck and 5'ver to the trailer hitch shop to have them set it up correctly . . . but I figured the trailer dealership knew what they were doing!

 

[rcharrette]

Thank you again everyone. I really appreciate all this information! I went to both the Ford and Dodge website today and was surprised to see Max Tow capacity on the Ford F350 (20,500LBS) was higher than the Dodge (17,500LBS). We've followed a few people online who are towing the exact model (GW 3800RLB) we want with a Single wheel rear. I know that doesn't make it right but I pan to look at the numbers carefully to see if we can make it work. Truth be told my wife hates pick up trucks and this was a big decision to go this route. A Dually would be over the top for her.

 

[TravelTiger]

Thank you again everyone. I really appreciate all this information! I went to both the Ford and Dodge website today and was surprised to see Max Tow capacity on the Ford F350 (20,500LBS) was higher than the Dodge (17,500LBS). We've followed a few people online who are towing the exact model (GW 3800RLB) we want with a Single wheel rear. I know that doesn't make it right but I pan to look at the numbers carefully to see if we can make it work. Truth be told my wife hates pick up trucks and this was a big decision to go this route. A Dually would be over the top for her.

Just because others are towing with inadequate trucks definitely doesn't make it ok.

If a dually is needed to be SAFE TOWING for you, your family and everyone around you, then that should be what determines the truck to get.

Please do not try to "get by" with an unsafe choice.

Www.fifthwheelst.com is a great resource for learning about safe towing. And, it's owner is a Heartland Owner!!

Btw, you can find a good used vehicle once you've done the research on tow ratings. That's what we did. Once we determined the truck we wanted, we did a search on cars.com for the exact make and model truck with the exact specs we wanted. Found about 5 in a 200 mile radius. We bought a used 2013 in 2015.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Shortest Straw]

There is probably a better argument to keep what you have now than get less of a pickup than you need if the wife hates pickups.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[rcharrette]

There is probably a better argument to keep what you have now than get less of a pickup than you need if the wife hates pickups.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I agree 100% and that may end up being the case. Our other option is to get the dually, keep our Land Rover and store it in California where we spend a good chunk of the winter. But of course then it's just sitting there 7+ months of the year. Decisions, decisions!