danemayer
Well-known member
Hi Fishon458,
Sorry to hear about your tire failures. As with all vehicles, the tires are warranted by the tire company. Here's a link to some information on Towmax warranty.
Towmax tire blow outs, Heartland may want your tire
- Thread starter mattpopp
- Start date
Hi Fishon458,
Sorry to hear about your tire failures. As with all vehicles, the tires are warranted by the tire company. Here's a link to some information on Towmax warranty.
mattpopp
Trouble Maker
The tire supplier is going to help you or Tredit. Good luck with wasting your time with them
HL paid for the damage on my trailer but it wasn't easy getting there. I had to **** a lot of people off to get help. Between a few forums and their FB page of constant rants. Having to deal with the Mods complaining about my complaining. A HL rep called me and gave me exactly the service I wanted. It was to bad they wouldn't do it without all of my hype first.
When I feel I am being cheated I turn into a Bulldog. I don't stop until there is a solution or I just can't physically progress anymore.
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SeattleLion
Well-known member
The more I read, the more concerned I get. Apparently, it is not a giant problem the first year or two (5,000 miles). However, without the emotion, a few things seem apparent: The Towmax tires have an exceptionally high load rating (3,900 lbs). This is the same as a typical G-rated tire. Our 5'ers are all at the heavy end of the range. Mine is in the 14,000 lb range 2,600 on the kingpin. So I probably have 12,000 lbs on the axles. The axles are 7,000 lb.
On paper, the Towmax tires can handle a bit under 8,000 lbs / axle. So the first point of failure is theoretically the axles. In practice, any underinflation will reduce the tire's capacity. In addition, dynamic stresses and non-uniform loading add to this. I suspect that the biggest risk is the low ply count. But I don't know.
In any case, I would like to consider replacing the tires some time this season. Based on all my reading, it appears my wheels are only 6" wide and the GY G614's want 6 1/2. I know it is possible to still use the 6" rims, but really if I want to minimize the risk of blowouts, I should have new wheels.
If this is the case, what is the best tire to get?
On paper, the Towmax tires can handle a bit under 8,000 lbs / axle. So the first point of failure is theoretically the axles. In practice, any underinflation will reduce the tire's capacity. In addition, dynamic stresses and non-uniform loading add to this. I suspect that the biggest risk is the low ply count. But I don't know.
In any case, I would like to consider replacing the tires some time this season. Based on all my reading, it appears my wheels are only 6" wide and the GY G614's want 6 1/2. I know it is possible to still use the 6" rims, but really if I want to minimize the risk of blowouts, I should have new wheels.
If this is the case, what is the best tire to get?
TravelTiger
Founding Texas-West Chapter Leaders-Retired
TowMax do not have 3900 weight rating.
ST235/80R16 3520 @ 80psi
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ST235/80R16 3520 @ 80psi
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SeattleLion
Well-known member
That makes a lot more sense. I got the original number from this forum. Still, the tires (barely) exceed axle ratings.
Miltp920
Well-known member
How I came to my decision: If you read every forum thread in a search for "towmax" on this site and other rv forums, most will say Goodyear G614, but 4 tires alone are $1500. Add rims, even though a Wingfoot Goodyear store told me that they would mount the G614 on my 6 inch OEM rim, you can add $$$ to the tab. I will not be buying GY at that price as my first option. I hope I do not regret it in time. The second best option seems to be the Sailun 14 ply, made in China,, but they are supposed to have the best or only QA Rating requirements for China tires. I was buying them until Sailun reccommended against mounting their tire on my 16x6 inch rim, even though I know others have had success mounting G rated 14 ply tires on OEM rims. Unless we each share model numbers and pictures, we really do not know which specific rim Heartland uses on each model they sell. All 16 inch rims are NOT created equal. At the tire store, NONE of them looked at my rim to give me prices, as long as I told them I saw the rim stamped for 110psi. They ALL said that if the factory mounted tire was 235, then they were comfortable mounting another 235 tire since that number was the same (except Sailun who my tire guy called). Going from 80 to 85 makes the tire taller and increases the load rating. My experience is that Towmax is 3520lbs rated at 80 psi. I am going with a F rated 12 ply 90 psi CarlisleRadial Trail RH 23585R16 rated at 3960lbs is an improvement over the E rated 10 ply Towmax. Since my axles are rated at 7000 total, 3500 each tire, my axles are the limiting component. I feel that I am increasing my margin to blowouts with the Carlisle tire at a price of $660 for four tires designed for a 16x6 rim. THIS boils down to no one can really say what is best, just what has been successful for them, and how much money they had to try to solve the problem. IF you have a heavy 5er 15,500 lbs, with two axles, you have more stress on each tire, 12,500 on tires-3000 on pin/hitch(based on my scale measurements). 12,500/4tires means 3125 needed per tire loading. (That is how Heartland can justify putting the 3520 lb rated tire on 5ers -11% margin). Add 20% margin and you desire 3750lbs for each tire. Summarize it that we should have had tires rated at 3750 each from Heartland and many of these blowouts would not be happening. IF you have 3 axles your 5er is probably 18,000 lbs with 3500 on pin (my guess), 15,000 /6 tires is 2500per tire. Weight is spread out more, but I think 3 axle 5ers are still buying better load rated tires based on personal or anecdotal experiences.. It ends up being a personal choice of brand and rating based on what people, even tire salesman, tell you and how much you want to spend. I have read the negative comments/experiences regarding Carlisle trailer tires. I have also read that the newer Carlisle manufacturing process Radial "RH", may solve the Carlisle issue with tire failure. RH was added to their tire to signify newer technology in manufacturing. Even though Carlisle Tires are made in China, Carlisle is an "American" company that chooses to have their factory in Asia, like most tire manufacturers. Carlisle claims they uphold "American" standards in part by having American managers overseeing their Asian operations. Time will tell. There HAS to be a less expensive proven tire besides the GY. I am hoping I can report good service from this RH Carlisle to help inform others on this site. IF they blowout too, I will be upgrading tires and rims to support 14 ply Sailun or GY. I have also read that LT light truck tires do NOT belong on trailers, and ST tires do NOT belong on trucks, however MANY have had success doing it with Michelin and other big name tires. Life is full of choices.
Miltp920
Well-known member
My friend blew two towmax recently and his tire store down south mounted G rated 14 ply Gladiator ST23585R16 QR25-TS rated at 4000 lbs per tire. He feels he has solved his issues going to the 14 ply tire. I saw these mounted on his Big Country. His rims also said 16x6 and 110psi. My tire salesman did not know much about Gladiator Tires, but they had Carlisles in stock. The Gladiators were $560 out the door for 4.
tireman9
Well-known member
Any of you with tire failures that are not due to identified problem such as leaking valve, puncture or impact should post a complaint with NHTSA. Improved quality has to be forced on manufacturers (not just for tires but for the entire RV industry).
NHTSA will not start an investigation without numbers of failure reports on hand. I have read numerous posts on forums of people having problems with XYZ brand tires but when I check the NHTSA records many times I find zero complaints. This means the problem is us. We won't bother to complain with the one agency that can force a tire recall. Look at recent Michelin recalls.
Tire recalls do happen but only if RV owners make the effort to file a complete (Full tire DOT and RV VIN numbers) complaint. It only taked a few minutes.
NHTSA will not start an investigation without numbers of failure reports on hand. I have read numerous posts on forums of people having problems with XYZ brand tires but when I check the NHTSA records many times I find zero complaints. This means the problem is us. We won't bother to complain with the one agency that can force a tire recall. Look at recent Michelin recalls.
Tire recalls do happen but only if RV owners make the effort to file a complete (Full tire DOT and RV VIN numbers) complaint. It only taked a few minutes.
mobilcastle
Well-known member
It seems like this decision is not an easy one. I have Sailons on my rig now. See my signature for the unit and year below. Is their a stamp on your rims somewhere where the size is located? I bought my rig slightly used and theses tires came mounted from the Heartland factory-my GVW is 16K. I think there are others on this forum who had them from the factory also.I will look at my rims inside to see if their is a number or stamp of some kind. I am very impressed with these tires and I started post on them some time ago as an alternative to Goodyear G614 which I feel are way over priced. My personal opinion is when rigs exceed 10K they should have LT's on them. I am only a consumer and I have no interest in the Sailon company-I have never read about a Sailon blowing up on any forum I post on. I hope you have good luck with whatever tire you choose.
Miltp920
Well-known member
Why couldn't I have been so lucky to have Sailun 14 ply come on my rig. We should not have to be worried about factory supplied tires. I ordered my Carlisles. I am committed now. Itwould be nice to know your exact rim specifications. brand model what is stamped inside the rim. Mine are Sendel T09 66867BM, 3750lbs 110psi. See attached pics.also important stamp on mine 16x6J, yours?
Attachments
mobilcastle
Well-known member
Milt,
My rims are marked
16x6J
Max load 3750
110 psi
Sorry it took so long to post. I hope you have good luck with your new tires.
Steve
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My rims are marked
16x6J
Max load 3750
110 psi
Sorry it took so long to post. I hope you have good luck with your new tires.
Steve
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mobilcastle
Well-known member
Yes it is original factory. It is funny, when I went to look at the trailer to buy it I had researched these tires and I had planned to change out whatever tires were on it to the Sailon's. I asked the owner if he had switched them out and he said no-they came new on the trailer-I was really happy about that. Mine were built in 2009 and they look brand new-they look better than the Michelin's on my truck. I have had no loss of air over the last two winters. I think they will fit just fine on your rig as others on this forum had them come from the factory or have switched over. IMHO these rigs are to heavy for ST tires. I do wish you luck with whatever you do with your tires.
Miltp920
Well-known member
When I first visited my local tire store, he gave me a price for "goodyear tires" When I showed up with my Cyclone for him to see rig and rims he told me he made a mistake, that he had quoted me Sailun 14 ply tire prices. I was happy. Told him I would call him back. Still wanted to check out two more local stores.. I had shared my concern over the 16x6J rim and having seen the Sailun tire specs on the web saying minimum rim 6.5inches. He told me that after he thought about it, he called Sailun, and they said NO to him mounting on my 6 inch rim. That put me into the Carlisle tire F range. When I called him back before having him mount the Carlisles, he said there is a class action lawsuit out there against tire shops mounting tires on the wrong rim. IF I wanted Sailun tires on my rims he would not be mounting them. I know you have a success story, so do others, but my luck, is that my tire guy won't mount them. So I will be reporting on the Carlisle Radial Trail RH F rated 12 ply. It has 3 sidewall plys, 5 in the tread. 3960 lbs 95 psi. Should be more margin than the blowmax. Time will tell. I could have bought from on line, but I still had to find a heavy tire store to mount them. Places like Discount and Belle tire here stop at 10 ply. I'm good with my decision. Hope my research backs up the tire I bought. Putting 1000 miles on her soon. I'll be watching these tires like a hawk, with my tire pressure monitoring system to boot.
CityFire1017
Member
My sentiments exactly!
mobilcastle
Well-known member
Excellent tires-I have them on my rig.
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Miltp920
Well-known member
I was a little surprised how much pressure change occurs going down the highway. If you dont have a tire pressure monitoring system, you may not even think about what is happening inside your tires. I saw about 10 psi gain and 5 to 15 degrees change in temperature. Slowing down from 60 to 55 mph did not seem to have an immediate effect but when I hit a reduced speed area 35 to 45, it seemed to cool off a degree or two. Can we compare pressures and temperature changes we have observed, and at what point ...increase should we stop and take action? Does the sunny side of the trailer make a difference or does any correlation to increased side temp need to be from a brake axle generating some heat?
TravelTiger
Founding Texas-West Chapter Leaders-Retired
Wow!! Sounds like Heartland has finally made a change?!!
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